otzi

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Minimalist
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Post by Minimalist »

"This is a lethal wound," Rühli says. "It was pretty quick. With this kind of bleeding, you don't go walking uphill for hours."
Very interesting but they still jump to some conclusions. Not the least of which is that Oetzi was alone. Why could he not have been with a companion or two....enough so that the sniper would not feel comfortable following up his kill. The companion could also have pulled the arrow and later abandoned Oetzi when it became clear that his wound was too bad to travel. For that matter, the companion could have left with the idea of getting help and returning.

Still....makes a rollicking good yarn.
Something is wrong here. War, disease, death, destruction, hunger, filth, poverty, torture, crime, corruption, and the Ice Capades. Something is definitely wrong. This is not good work. If this is the best God can do, I am not impressed.

-- George Carlin
kbs2244
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Post by kbs2244 »

You know;
If he was a lowlands rich kid out for a bit of adventure, he just might have been from the other side of the mountain.
His climbing up the hill may have been an act of trying to get back home.
Beagle
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Post by Beagle »

THE OBJECT OF ALL THIS intense scientific attention is a freeze-dried slab of human jerky, which since 1998 has resided in a refrigerated, high-tech chamber in the South Tyrol Museum of Archaeology in Bolzano, Italy. The temptation to conduct fresh experiments on the body rises with every new twist of technology, each revealing uncannily precise details about his life. Using a sophisticated analysis of isotopes in one of the Iceman's teeth, for example, scientists led by Wolfgang Müller (now at the Royal Holloway, University of London) have shown that he probably grew up in the Valle Isarco, an extensive north-south valley that includes the modern-day town of Bressanone. Isotope levels in his bones, meanwhile, match those in the soil and water of two alpine valleys farther west, the Val Senales and the Val Venosta. Müller's team has also analyzed microscopic chips of mica recovered from the Iceman's intestines, which were probably ingested accidentally in food made from stone-ground grain; geologic ages of the mica best match a small area limited to the lower Val Venosta. The Iceman probably set off on his final journey from this very area, near where the modern-day Adige and Senales Rivers meet.
These guys are able to tell where he was born, and where he lived most of his life.
Beagle
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Post by Beagle »

http://www7.nationalgeographic.com/ngm/ ... media.html

Interactive page from NGM to examine the body and artifacts of Otzi.
Minimalist
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Post by Minimalist »

Pretty cool.
Something is wrong here. War, disease, death, destruction, hunger, filth, poverty, torture, crime, corruption, and the Ice Capades. Something is definitely wrong. This is not good work. If this is the best God can do, I am not impressed.

-- George Carlin
ravenwing5910
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Post by ravenwing5910 »

Nice site Beagle, but I wish they had included more images. for instance the tattooing on his back. and different views of the body. I would also like to see the evidence of the head wound. Is there sufficient evidence to tell if the wound was perimortem, or post mortem. If the wound was severe enough to cause death then there should have been ample bleeding at the wound. I would also think that a wound to the subclavical artery would have killed him rather rapidly, arteries don't just ooze blood they spurt.

Does anyone know if the site where he was found was examined at all for evidence of the blood. If his body was so well preserved I would think that there would still be signs of the blood pool.

It is a very curious mystery and quite fun to speculate but I really want to see the evidence.
Minimalist
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Post by Minimalist »

They found lots of blood on his clothing. His own and at least two other persons, I seem to recall.
Something is wrong here. War, disease, death, destruction, hunger, filth, poverty, torture, crime, corruption, and the Ice Capades. Something is definitely wrong. This is not good work. If this is the best God can do, I am not impressed.

-- George Carlin
ravenwing5910
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Post by ravenwing5910 »

That is the type of thing I would like to see. The patterns of the blood on the clothing, there must have been alot of blood I would like to know where most of it gathered. Also was there blood inside the cap? Did the head wound have an open scalp wound? (probably not since they just found it). Do we know if there has been any attempt to do DNA testing to see if there is any relation between the blood types found? I always have more questions than answers. :?
Minimalist
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Post by Minimalist »

I don't know.

Most of the stuff I saw about the blood was on a Discovery channel program or something.
Something is wrong here. War, disease, death, destruction, hunger, filth, poverty, torture, crime, corruption, and the Ice Capades. Something is definitely wrong. This is not good work. If this is the best God can do, I am not impressed.

-- George Carlin
Rokcet Scientist

Post by Rokcet Scientist »

But in any case, this scenario squarely makes him a 'valley man'. Not a mountain man. Oetzi never stood a chance up there.
Beagle
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Post by Beagle »

ravenwing5910 wrote:Nice site Beagle, but I wish they had included more images. for instance the tattooing on his back. and different views of the body. I would also like to see the evidence of the head wound. Is there sufficient evidence to tell if the wound was perimortem, or post mortem. If the wound was severe enough to cause death then there should have been ample bleeding at the wound. I would also think that a wound to the subclavical artery would have killed him rather rapidly, arteries don't just ooze blood they spurt.

Does anyone know if the site where he was found was examined at all for evidence of the blood. If his body was so well preserved I would think that there would still be signs of the blood pool.

It is a very curious mystery and quite fun to speculate but I really want to see the evidence.
You're asking good questions RW. Thanks for the entertaining and yet scientific mystery. I'm glad you don't mind our occassional wild speculation.
ravenwing5910
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Post by ravenwing5910 »

I think that wild speculation can often lead to a credible hypothesis. And even if it doesn't at least it is fun. :D
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Digit
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Post by Digit »

Speculation has been condemned on a number of occasions on this forum RW, but like your self, I see it as as fleshing out the basic facts then testing them against the evidence.
First people deny a thing, then they belittle it, then they say it was known all along! Von Humboldt
kbs2244
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Post by kbs2244 »

So, if we know where he was born and lived, which side of the mountin ws he on?
Was he running away from home or to it?
Beagle
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Post by Beagle »

http://www7.nationalgeographic.com/ngm/ ... load.2.pdf

Here is a map of the route that he took (theorized), and it looks like he's heading up and over the mountain to a place that he was presumably familiar with.
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