Fluted Points in Alaska

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archaeo
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Fluted Points in Alaska

Post by archaeo » Sat Mar 13, 2010 8:59 am

Fluted Points from the Bering Land Bridge
http://qmackie.wordpress.com/2010/03/06 ... nd-bridge/
March 6, 2010
Serpentine Hot Springs, has come to light on Alaska’s Seward Peninsula (the bit that sticks out closest to Asia – map) which has revealed numerous fluted points. These date to about 12,000 calendar years ago, which is around one thousand years more recent than Clovis itself. At this time, Beringia was still largely dry land and the Seward Peninsula a range of hills in the centre-right of this picture:
...........

====================
Ice-Age Humans of the Bering Land Bridge:

Archeology of Serpentine Hot Springs, Bering Land Bridge National Preserve, Alaska
Ted Goebel, Center for the Study of the First Americans, Texas A&M University
http://www.nps.gov/bela/historyculture/people.htm
....
During summer 2009 the Center for the Study of the First Americans (at Texas A&M University) and National Park Service had the opportunity to investigate what may be the first Ice-Age archeological site yet found in the Bering Land Bridge National Preserve. The site is located near Serpentine Hot Springs, and it contains stone tools and animal bones preliminarily dated to about 12,000 calendar years ago.

Our research focuses on the first peopling of the Americas during the Ice Age (or Pleistocene) period. We are interested in chronicling and explaining the origins of the first Americans. From where did they come? When did they disperse from northeast Asia to Beringia? How did they spread from Alaska to the rest of the Americas? Our research into these questions covers three continents and numerous scientific fields, not just archeology but also geology, paleontology, paleobotany, and even human genetics.

Much of the debate surrounding the origins of the first Americans is centered on the significance of the Clovis culture ...........

.... Conclusions

Given the work we have accomplished thus far, we offer the following conclusions. ........

(3) Elements of fluted-point technology as well as blade/microblade technology seem to co-occur at the site, even around the same dated feature. ...........

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Digit
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Re: Fluted Points in Alaska

Post by Digit » Sat Mar 13, 2010 9:39 am

IIRC correctly fluted points are all but unknown in Asia, if so, logic says they came from the south.

Roy.
First people deny a thing, then they belittle it, then they say it was known all along! Von Humboldt

Rokcet Scientist

Re: Fluted Points in Alaska

Post by Rokcet Scientist » Sat Mar 13, 2010 9:54 am

Digit wrote: IIRC correctly fluted points are all but unknown in Asia, if so, logic says they came from the south.
Does logic also tell you they came from the south in Asia, of from the south in America?

Besides: Ish' logic tells her they came from the west, from the Altai...

So we got a logic clash here.

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Digit
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Re: Fluted Points in Alaska

Post by Digit » Sat Mar 13, 2010 10:12 am

What is it Mich says, we have the fossils!
No fluted points in Asia means that either they started an entirely new scheme of tool making once in to America or they didn't come from Asia!

Roy.
First people deny a thing, then they belittle it, then they say it was known all along! Von Humboldt

uniface

Re: Fluted Points in Alaska

Post by uniface » Sat Mar 13, 2010 10:30 am

Elements of fluted-point technology as well as blade/microblade technology seem to co-occur at the site, even around the same dated feature.
Well, Duhhh . . .

Clovis lithic technology, like that of the European Aurignacian era (the last however many thousand years of which overlapped the better-known Solturean) was a core-&-blade technology. Period.

It would be odd in the extreme if they didn't co-occur.

Looks like somebody didn't get the memo :oops:
Last edited by uniface on Sun Mar 14, 2010 8:57 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Digit
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Re: Fluted Points in Alaska

Post by Digit » Sat Mar 13, 2010 10:48 am

I did get the memo, there is absolutely no reason why two different groups, one from the east and one from the south, could not have used the same shelters etc.
In fact, if two different people were heading towards each other, at some point it would appear to be inevitable.
My original point stands.

Roy.
First people deny a thing, then they belittle it, then they say it was known all along! Von Humboldt

kbs2244
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Re: Fluted Points in Alaska

Post by kbs2244 » Sat Mar 13, 2010 12:17 pm

So, what you are purposing is an eastward movement out of Asia meeting, or at least time sharing living space, with a westward movement out of Europe?

Can we assume the westward movement to be boat based since they had further to go and the large amount of water in north Canada?

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Digit
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Re: Fluted Points in Alaska

Post by Digit » Sat Mar 13, 2010 1:28 pm

No kb, I never mentioned Europe.
If we are to assume that the two dissimilar tool types represent two distinct cultures we need to trace their origins.
Some fluted points have been found at one site in Asia, which with a land bridge is reasonable, but the Asian culture is predominantly microlithic, whereas the north American culture is predominantly not so.

Roy.
First people deny a thing, then they belittle it, then they say it was known all along! Von Humboldt

uniface

Re: Fluted Points in Alaska

Post by uniface » Sat Mar 13, 2010 2:03 pm

I was commenting on the government blurb, Roy.

Not on what you wrote.

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Digit
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Re: Fluted Points in Alaska

Post by Digit » Sat Mar 13, 2010 2:10 pm

Sorryyyyy!

Roy.
First people deny a thing, then they belittle it, then they say it was known all along! Von Humboldt

E.P. Grondine

Re: Fluted Points in Alaska

Post by E.P. Grondine » Sat Mar 13, 2010 6:03 pm

It appears that the inventory of Clovis finds from the South East is ending the old model of one or two Beringia crossings, and the 11,500 BCE date appears to be (is) dead as well:

http://www.nps.gov/history/seac/outline ... source.htm

My guess is that this "solutrean" technology came from the Sahara River region via South America (boats! min), as such a model provides the only explanation for the gross physical characteristics of the Yuchee and Ocanachee peoples (5 foot maximum male adult height, "unusual" eye color, hair different from other Native American peoples, etc. )

Technology spread was most likely along the Gulf coast at first, and then along mammoth and eastern bison migrations via salt licks from summer pasture to winter pasture and back.

Possibly 500 - 750 miles per year.

This explains the late occurrence in Alaska.

E.P. Grondine
Man and Impact in the Americas

archaeo
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Re: Fluted Points in Alaska

Post by archaeo » Sun Mar 14, 2010 8:51 am

The evidenciary context, the known material archaeology, seems lacking in the discussion.
Scroll down in this article for a summation, albeit now out-of-date.
Non-microblade migration/culture comes first across Siberia with first modern peopling.

PALEOAMERICAN ORIGINS:
A Review of Hypotheses and Evidence Relating to the Origins of the First Americans
http://jqjacobs.net/anthro/paleoamerican_origins.html

" There is considerable radiometric evidence, albeit disputed in its interpretation, that modern humans occupied the Americas before 12,000 years ago (Adovasio et al. 1978, Adovasio et al. 1988, Adovasio et al. 1990, Bennett 1986, Borrero 1996, Byran and Tuohy 1999, Green 1962, Holen 1996, Holmes et al. 1996, Lorenzo and Mirambell 1999, Miller 1982, Wychoff et al. 1990). The dating of Monte Verde in Chile, the most widely accepted pre-Clovis site in South America, is between 12,500 and 13,000 B.P., with one date of 13,565 (Dillehay 1989).

"Mid-Latitude North America

"Paleoamerican lithic assemblages are well known. The Clovis complex of the Paleo-Indian tradition is the most widespread cultural complex in North America. Clovis and Clovis-like points are found throughout North America. This industry lacks microcores and microblades and is characterized by flake and blade core technology, bifacial projectile points (predominantly lanceolate fluted points), end scrapers, side scrapers, gravers, and rarely burins (Hoffecker et al. 1993:51). Microblade technology did not spread outside of the northern regions in North America during Paleo-Indian times, and only extended to the Pacific Northwest much later in time.

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