Neanderthal DNA

[Cognito]

As I said, there is no evidence of conflict in the Levant, in the whole 20,000 yrs. they lived in proximity. Quite the opposite actually.

Beags, there is no evidence anywhere that there were ever any hostilities between the two groups. By "winning" in Israel I was stating that Neanderthals repopulated an area where HSS disappeared, either by hybridization or otherwise. It's a situation that fits Wolpoff's multi-regionalist views, but cannot be reconciled by OOA.

[Minimalist]

Maybe all the HSS's were killed off by the Toba eruption so the Neanderthals just moved back into the neighborhood?

The timing works.

[Forum Monk]

Beags, there is no evidence anywhere that there were ever any hostilities between the two groups. By "winning" in Israel I was stating that Neanderthals repopulated an area where HSS disappeared, either by hybridization or otherwise. It's a situation that fits Wolpoff's multi-regionalist views, but cannot be reconciled by OOA.

Maybe there is no evidence they were hostile but really there is very little, they cooperated. It seems the evidence is, they lived in close proximity. But what happens when the resources get short and the babies are crying from hunger? They either migrate away or they fight for whats left.

[Cognito]

Maybe there is no evidence they were hostile but really there is very little, they cooperated. It seems the evidence is, they lived in close proximity. But what happens when the resources get short and the babies are crying from hunger? They either migrate away or they fight for whats left.

Monk, there is no physical evidence of fighting but there is evidence of cooperation ... i.e. hybrids. After sex I doubt they relaxed and had a cigarette, but there was some sort of communication to get to that point in the first place (other than OOH - AHH).

[Forum Monk]

Hybrid cross-breeds ,eh:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsDWzhkiIbc

[Beagle]

What about the article I posted there. They were sharing technology evidently. Human caves with Mousterian tools? Unless they stole them in a raid of course.

[Digit]

With our government's target of sending 50% of school leavers to university they have have to downgrade and produce what we call 'Mickey Mouse' degrees, such as a degree in Madonna would you believe. I'm wondering what would happen if one of our universities were to offer a degree course in stupidity or common sense removal.

[Minimalist]

I'm wondering what would happen if one of our universities were to offer a degree course in stupidity or common sense removal.

Among other things...Bush wouldn't have to worry about getting by with a "c".

[Beagle]

http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?articl ... anID=sa003

Researchers have uncovered more than 10,000 short stretches of what may be functional DNA in parts of the human genome with no obvious role—the so-called junk DNA that makes up 95 percent of the genome. The segments appear to be fragments of transposons, pieces of DNA capable of copying themselves and inserting into new locations, up to millions of times.

Short article about "junk" DNA. Maybe not so junky after all. Ergaster goes Neandertal, Neandertal goes Cro Magnon, etc. That "junk" must be there for something.

[Digit]

How typical of experts, can't understand it so ignore it or rubbish it.

[Cognito]

The segments appear to be fragments of transposons, pieces of DNA capable of copying themselves and inserting into new locations, up to millions of times.

Transposons are not really "junk" DNA, but mutagens. Drastically change the environment somehow, and you'll need them.

[Beagle]

http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/ ... 042307.php

For nearly a century, anthropologists have been debating the relationship of Neandertals to modern humans. Central to the debate is whether Neandertals contributed directly or indirectly to the ancestry of the early modern humans that succeeded them.

As this discussion has intensified in the past decades, it has become the central research focus of Erik Trinkaus, Ph.D., professor of anthropology at Washington University in St. Louis. Trinkaus has examined the earliest modern humans in Europe, including specimens in Romania, Czech Republic and France. Those specimens, in Trinkaus' opinion, have shown obvious Neandertal ancestry.

In an article appearing the week of April 23 in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, Trinkaus has brought together the available data, which shows that early modern humans did exhibit evidence of Neandertal traits.

"When you look at all of the well dated and diagnostic early modern European fossils, there is a persistent presence of anatomical features that were present among the Neandertals but absent from the earlier African modern humans," Trinkaus said. "Early modern Europeans reflect both their predominant African early modern human ancestry and a substantial degree of admixture between those early modern humans and the indigenous Neandertals."

This analysis, along with a number of considerations of human genetics, argues that the fate of the Neandertals was to be absorbed into modern human groups. Just as importantly, it also says that the behavioral difference between the groups were small. They saw each other as social equals.

No need to click on the link, this is the entire statement. Trinkaus seems to be making a declarative statement here, that Neandertal evolved by genetically merging with other humans to become modern Europeans.

Trinkaus seems to be taking a professional stand in advance of any statement by Paabo et al. I think he must be aware of where their progress is at this point and what their ultimate conclusions will be, so this is very interesting. I don't think any one person has done as much as Trinkaus in keeping this issue on the front burner, even in the light of recent genetic findings. Go Eric, go.

From Archaeologica News

[Charlie Hatchett]

http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/ ... 042307.php

For nearly a century, anthropologists have been debating the relationship of Neandertals to modern humans. Central to the debate is whether Neandertals contributed directly or indirectly to the ancestry of the early modern humans that succeeded them.

As this discussion has intensified in the past decades, it has become the central research focus of Erik Trinkaus, Ph.D., professor of anthropology at Washington University in St. Louis. Trinkaus has examined the earliest modern humans in Europe, including specimens in Romania, Czech Republic and France. Those specimens, in Trinkaus' opinion, have shown obvious Neandertal ancestry.

In an article appearing the week of April 23 in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, Trinkaus has brought together the available data, which shows that early modern humans did exhibit evidence of Neandertal traits.

"When you look at all of the well dated and diagnostic early modern European fossils, there is a persistent presence of anatomical features that were present among the Neandertals but absent from the earlier African modern humans," Trinkaus said. "Early modern Europeans reflect both their predominant African early modern human ancestry and a substantial degree of admixture between those early modern humans and the indigenous Neandertals."

This analysis, along with a number of considerations of human genetics, argues that the fate of the Neandertals was to be absorbed into modern human groups. Just as importantly, it also says that the behavioral difference between the groups were small. They saw each other as social equals.

No need to click on the link, this is the entire statement. Trinkaus seems to be making a declarative statement here, that Neandertal evolved by genetically merging with other humans to become modern Europeans.

Trinkaus seems to be taking a professional stand in advance of any statement by Paabo et al. I think he must be aware of where their progress is at this point and what their ultimate conclusions will be, so this is very interesting. I don't think any one person has done as much as Trinkaus in keeping this issue on the front burner, even in the light of recent genetic findings. Go Eric, go.

Makes good horse sense. If Neanderthals had their roots in Africa, which I admit is debatable, why couldn't they have mated with their African brethren?

[Beagle]

Exactly Charlie. That's what many of us have been saying for a long time.

[Charlie Hatchett]

Exactly Charlie. That's what many of us have been saying for a long time.

Yes sir. Amazing what open minds can come up with.