Experts prove satyrs once walked the earth

War Arrow · Post by **War Arrow** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 3:27 am

Heavy sigh...
http://www.usatoday.com/tech/science/co ... -man_N.htm
I've heard a few of my transatlantic brethren remark that USA Today is one step removed from National Enquirer, and maybe I heard wrong but...
Could they not just report this as it was found? The idea that one person thinks the guy's face looked a bit goaty seems more like opinion than newsworthy theory. I mean especially what with the regular human legs and all. I don't know if this is even worth a thread but it just seems a bit comical (even satirical, but I couldn't come up with a pun that I could've used as a thread title without feeling a great sense of shame) the idea that every archaic myth needs to have some sort of basis in observed reality. No doubt some did, but can't we at least credit our ancestors with a little bit of imagination? I suppose that Chimera chappie must have been a lion with peculiarly goat-faced patterns in the fur on its back and an occasional snake-like hissing sound coming from its rear end.
Anyway, when they write things like 'expert opinions are mixed' I guess that means 'expert opinions comprised polite tolerance from those who weren't rolling around and laughing like hyenas whilst banging a fist on the floor.' I'm all for an open mind but there's got to be limits. Life's too short.

Rokcet Scientist · Post by **Rokcet Scientist** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 6:36 am

You wouldn't have anything to bitch about!

Post by **Minimalist** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 10:12 am

Stanford University's Adrienne Mayor, a folklorist, specializes in analyzing how fossil discoveries in prehistory may have led to legends such as the Titans of Greek mythology (botched reconstructions of mammoth bones)

I saw a special on this and while interesting it seemed to have a major flaw. Dinosaur bones which fossilize are found preserved in rock. The process for chipping those bones out of the rock is painstaking and I have trouble imagining the ancient Greeks having that kind of patience.

Rokcet Scientist · Post by **Rokcet Scientist** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 12:13 pm

Minimalist wrote:
Dinosaur bones which fossilize are found preserved in rock.

It could just as easily have been mammoth bones that led to those myths. And mammoth bones don't have to be fossilized to survive 10, 20, or 30 millennia. If they are covered by sediment, silt, their condition hardly changes, and there is no need to 'painstakingly chip those bones out of rock'!

Thousands of mammoth bones and tusks have been accidentaly 'caught' in North Sea fishermans' nets in the past 1,000 years. And are still being 'caught' each year.

I expect the Aegean Sea wasn't/isn't too much different.

Post by **Minimalist** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 1:39 pm

In the special the lady was discussing the finding of the "frill" of triceratops as the basis for some mythic creature. Mastodons did not have such frills.

The use of elephants in India and Mesopotamia was certainly widespread enough that the ancient Greeks would have known what they were. There are depictions of elephants on Sumerian reliefs going back 4,500 years.

Rokcet Scientist · Post by **Rokcet Scientist** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 4:01 pm

Sediment is not just soft clay, but also sand, begetting 'soft' sandstone over time (and marble under more pressure), or even lime sedimentation or coral building, begetting soft limestone and chalk over time. Not very hard to chip away, a hundred centuries later.
I'm sure real geologists can probably make that list grow a dozen or 2!

Oh yeah, don't forget archaic peat bogs, swamps, and marshes, later dried out and cut up over 20,000 years to heat the dwellings of man. While excavating/'mining' the peat it was an everyday experience to find more or less well preserved remains of archaic animals. Or people.
We call 'm 'peat mummies'.

War Arrow · Post by **War Arrow** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 5:26 am

Rokcet Scientist wrote:You wouldn't have anything to bitch about!

I expect I could find something if I looked hard enough.

Rokcet Scientist · Post by **Rokcet Scientist** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 6:19 am

Here's your mythical Greek beast, Min! It's got five meter long tusks!

Tuesday, 24 July 2007, 11:52 GMT

Greek mastodon find 'spectacular'

The remains of a prehistoric mastodon - a mammoth-like animal - have been found in northern Greece, including intact long tusks.
A Dutch scientist at the site, Dick Mol, says the find near Grevena should help explain why mastodons died out in Europe two to three million years ago.

The mastodon's tusks measure 5m (16.5ft) and 4m, Mr Mol told the BBC.

They are the longest tusks ever found on a prehistoric elephant-like animal. "It is spectacular," Mr Mol said.

[...]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/6913366.stm

Imo, if the ancient Hellenes stumbled upon a find like that only once that would be enough to feed millennia of mythical stories.

Post by **Minimalist** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 8:49 am

Um...what mythical beast had 5 meter long tusks?

Again, the ancients knew about elephants,

Rokcet Scientist · Post by **Rokcet Scientist** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 11:47 am

Minimalist wrote:Um...what mythical beast had 5 meter long tusks?

Again, the ancients knew about elephants,

Fine, so they occassionaly stumbled upon the remains of some other frightening beast, now (and then too) extinct, that scared the living shits out of 'm and gave rise to all sorts of stories, legends, and myths. Happy?

You may choose from this list:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megafauna# ... _megafauna

Here's a unicorn for you (Elasmotherium sibiricum):