Shuffling the Deck Again

[Tiompan]

Good thing you can't be arrested for dumping rubbish at a message board.

The usual type of response from the alt crowd when confronted with evidence they can't refute or provide anything meaningful .

[Tiompan]

How many times has the eveidence shown you to have got it wrong . ?

What 'evidence'?
I didn't see you post any

Odd how you continually manage to avoid it and avoid presenting any evidence yourself .
For starters .
"“Nature doesn't create right angles like that, repeated again and again and again. Nature doesn't create flat surfaces like that, repeated again and again and again. Nature doesn't create perfectly fitting corners and joints like that, repeated again and again and again. Nature doesn't align boulders and rocks like that, repeated again and again and again.”

http://oldfieldslimestone.blogspot.co.u ... 21_22.html

Scroll down http://www.yosemite.ca.us/library/geolo ... ution.html ro rectangular blocks .The scroll further for explanation .

You got any evidence for the natural stuff being man made . It wasn't off they top off your head , I know that ,although it was wishful thinking , it came for from some dodgy website .

You must have seen http://www.titanicwalk.com/a-touch-of-m ... -causeway/
and https://www.flickr.com/photos/gms/4681115733
Right angles
http://www.australienbilder.de/serien/s ... -tas21.htm

http://oldfieldslimestone.blogspot.co.u ... 21_22.html

Scroll down http://www.yosemite.ca.us/library/geolo ... ution.html ro rectangular blocks .The scroll further for explanation .
http://plantsandrocks.blogspot.ca/2014/ ... white.html

Scroll down to Gutter Tor
http://www.dartmoorcam.co.uk/cam/previouswalks/2009-9- 3_RingmoorDown/ringmoor.htm

http://xtremesport4u.com/extreme-land-s ... -cornwall/

5th pic for a natural example of a pillar like the stone man /pillar you provided .
http://www.123rf.com/stock-photo/basalt ... llars.html

First pic
http://themagicofcornwall.photoshelter. ... ry/Bodmin- Moor/G0000.WnKSRmgppc/

Scroll down to pic of Tor with letters . https://www.geocaching.com/geocache/GC1 ... helman-tor

http://www.kitmikayitours.com/wgalleryd ... _id=231485
http://www.alpenverein.de/bergsport/100 ... 12428.html

It was a couple of weeks ago so maybe you have forgotten about it .

Then there was “Hagar Qim, a probably middle to late pleistocene 'temple'”

“Current evidence for the archipelago establishes human occupation on the islands
at about 7200 years ago, (Blouet, 2007).”

“ Deposits at its base contained material from the first known human occupation of the island, the Għar Dalam phase, including charcoal, which carbon analysis dated to 4850 BC. “


Then failing to accept ,despite your "studies " , that it was covered in sand when first excavated .
In “Recent further excavations of the Megalithic Antiquities of Hagiar-Kim, Malta executed in the year 1885.” The writer and excavator Dr. Caruana talking of the monument says “drifting soil was accumulated up to the height of seven or eight feet, . . leaving only the tops of the taller stones visible. From “Description of an ancient Temple near Crendi, Malta. In a Letter from J. G. Vance,

“So they were entombed at the time of Comm. Abela [the Maltese historian]
in 1642, and up to the time of their discovery in 1827 and 1839. Several
of the stones have since been carted away, even recently, for walling up
the terraces of newly cultivated lands. “

“The remains of Ha gar Qim were never completely buried
after they fell into disuse. They were first mentioned in
print in 1647 (Abela 1647) and were also depicted in an
engraving in the 1780s (Houel 1787). This engraving and
accompanying description clearly show that while the
majority of the site was buried, the top parts of the taller
megaliths remained visible “ John Cassar et al in “Shelters over the Megalithic Temples of Malta: debate, design and implementation “

And all the while never providing any evidence to refute these points or support your fantasies .

No wonder you forget .

[uniface]

The usual type of response from the alt crowd when confronted with evidence they can't refute or provide anything meaningful .

In response to someone invoking a string of unsound generalisations as if they established anything.

[Tiompan]

The usual type of response from the alt crowd when confronted with evidence they can't refute or provide anything meaningful .

In response to someone invoking a string of unsound generalisations as if they established anything.

There is no pre Clovis mt DNA haplogroup M in the Americas and the ancient DNA found in the Americas supports the contention
that the ancestry of the earliest Americans can be traced to Asia , not Europe .

The facts relating to the genetic evidence are not generalisations .

[Tiompan]

The first hominids arrived on foot, in the pleistocene, before the breaching of the pillars of Hercules that turned it into an island. That's when Hagar Qim was built.

That is fantasy with absolutely no supporting evidence and none expected .
Did you miss “Current evidence for the archipelago establishes human occupation on the islands
at about 7200 years ago, (Blouet, 2007).”

“ Deposits at its base contained material from the first known human occupation of the island, the Għar Dalam phase, including charcoal, which carbon analysis dated to 4850 BC. “

So they had about two and a half million years to do so. Who 'they' were? Take your pick. It could have been any of the early hominids from homo habilis forward. My guess is heidelbergensis, neandertal, or sapiens. How did they do the heavy lifting? With technology from and by the same source that 'assisted' the ancient Egyptians in hauling 5 million multi-ton blocks to construct the pyramids in the first millennia of the holocene.

It gets worse . Guessing isn't too helpul if you don't know the subject ,can't provide evidence and rely on fantasy writers for info .
There is no evidence anywhere that heidelbergensis, or neandertals built monuments , the earliest monument we are aware of is Gobeli Tepe which has been dated with convergent evidence not dreamt up to suit some agenda .
Beliefs are not evidence ,so before coming up with more fantasies provide the supporting evidence first .

[Tiompan]

Currrent does not mean what you say , look it up . Further it was related to evidence , something you continually fail to prodcue .
here's another example ,one you ignored "“ Deposits at its base contained material from the first known human occupation of the island, the Għar Dalam phase, including charcoal, which carbon analysis dated to 4850 BC. “
Or maybe yopu jut ignore that which is contrary to evidence free beliefs .
There is no competition for getting wrong ,the alt crowd is a long way ahead on that score ,always was ,always will be , why do accept that level of error .
As mentioned earlier no evidence expected and none provided .
Why even mention Gunung Padang when there is nothing to supoport the fantasy .

[Tiompan]

"charcoal, which carbon analysis dated to 4850 BC. “

That doesn't prove when 'they' arrived on Malta. It only indicates how old that particular specimen was.
Maybe 'they' were there 10 or 20 KY earlier but the establishment didn't (yet) find that charcoal to date. Not finding something doesn't mean it doesn't exist (or has existed). It only means that you haven't found it. Yet. Nothing more.

Of course it doesn't provide a date for the earliest arrival on Malta ,it didn't say that .
It said “ Deposits at its base contained material from the first known human occupation of the island, the Għar Dalam phase, including charcoal, which carbon analysis dated to 4850 BC. “
Repeat " the first known human occupation of the island," note "known " .
You said “Hagar Qim, a probably middle to late pleistocene 'temple' " i.e. approx 100,000-17 ,000 BP which only the upper limit squeezees into the revised suggestion of 10-20KY whay happened to the other 80,000 years ?
From "middle to late pleistocene" it is now "maybe" 10-20 KY . "Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence "taken to extremes and qualified with a maybe is meaningless ,you could say that about anywhere and anything .
If there were people on the island building monuments like Hagar Qim for 10-20 ky before that charcoal date is it not likely that we might have found some evidence ?
Provide some evidence and then it could be discussed .

[uniface]

This is not testimony in court.

It is sidebar debate as to what testimony is admissible.

Playing How-do-we-know-that-we-know-what-we-know is all very well. But not when such wranglings are mistaken for evaluations of the matter that prompts them.

They did that with pre-Clovis man in the Americas, for decades. In the end, they finally had to admit that the evidence for him had been obvious for at least 15 years, and that all their antiaircraft flack barrage had accomplished was to delay acceptance of it by the trend-followers.

I think that's what you're doing here. Dissecting real issues into abstractions and using them to do logic chopping -- the classic Sophomore Bull Session.

[Tiompan]

If you can't support the fantasies with evidence then they will be highlighted for what they are .
You can believe what you like , but don't expect others to accept it if there is nothing to support it
The fantastical nature of the beliefs are exacrebated by the likelihood of the sources , i.e. fringe/new age / pseudoscientific writers /web sites that are no more trustworthy
or worse than their predecessors , Cayce , Von Daniken , the Theosophists etc , but the appeal is the same .

[uniface]

The likelihood of parallel, independent creation of the elaborate Solutrian/Clovis lithic technology -- using known historical parallels as a guide -- is zero.

In light of which fact your rants are campaign speeches.

[Tiompan]

It gets worse .Read what I said “middle to late pleistocene 'temple' " i.e. approx 100,000-17 ,000 BP “ .Note the approx
I was giving you the benefit of the doubt by not going to the start seeing as you had finished up in the Late Pleistocene could you possibly be suggesting that Hagar Qim was built more than 100,000 years ago . It looks like you are , according to your figure of 1,300,000 years ago . That is more sad than hilarious .
Regardless , get your facts right “The Middle Pleistocene, more specifically referred to as the Ionian stage, is a period of geologic time from ca. 781 to 126 thousand years ago . “ wiki or try any other non alt source .That means your start is out by over a million years ," e.g. the middle to late pleistocene was from 1,300,000 to 11,700 years ago." a blink in the eye of a super civilisation or someone who doesn’t bother about dates .

Erectus didn't builld monuments either .If you believe they did, best keep that to yourself , or provide something to support it .

[Tiompan]

Providing evidence that is contrary to the Solutrean hypothesis and your beliefs is not ranting or red herrings .
I have already explained that the similarities are not as great as you believe , never mind the obvious problems about the spatial and temporal distance and lack of
any other similarities and the most obvious case of similar developments , with of course Clovis being much later .
Hyper diffusionism is a simplistic response , have you never noticed the similarities of symbols the world over ,
do you think that might be due to contact or something more obvious ?
Newton and Leibniz were spatially and temporally close , yet both came up with the calculus ,(something most believers in the Solutrean hypothesis will have problems with )yet
with no co-operation between them .etc .

[Tiompan]

Your comment "the middle to late pleistocene was from 1,300,000 to 11,700 years ago."
The wiki entry for for start of the middle Pleistocene "“The Middle Pleistocene, more specifically referred to as the Ionian stage, is a period of geologic time from ca. 781 to 126 thousand years ago . “
Simple arithmetic with a calculator ,hardly maths 1,300,000 - 781,000=519000
That's an error of over half a million years . More importantly , you believe the greater figure of a million years plus could have been when the Hagar Qim was built .
That's way beyond Palin .
And still no evidence .

[Tiompan]

Theres a lot of stiff competition but you might well be the thickest one yet .

Again you misundrstand the simplest english never mind the arithmetic .
Note what was explained to you ,i.e. thepoint where you were out by half a million years ."“The Middle Pleistocene, more specifically referred to as the Ionian stage, is a period of geologic time from ca. 781 to 126 thousand years ago . “ . Repeat for the 4th time ? "Middle Pleistocene started 178,000 YA " . Note that that isn't 2.6 million years .
The dates of the entire period are not split into equal sized chunks but are related to particular geological events , fwiw and not that it will sink in until it gets repeated multiple times , in this case the start of the middle Pleistocne followed the Brunhes–Matuyama reversal .