ed wrote:Anyway, expound on the two flood versions.
Far be it for me to deny the request to [Pontificate--Ed.] educate. . . .
Actually, I need to compile the "evidences" on the Floods specifically since I rarely meet a fundi willing to fight on this regard--seriously. Here is a short description I did regarding the amount of water:
The relevant passages are:
- J: Gen 7:19-20
P: Gen 8:1-2a; 3b-5
And the waters had grown very, very strong on the earth, so they covered all the high mountains that are under all the skies. Fifteen cubits above, the waters grew stronger, and they covered the mountains.
And Elohim remembered Noah and all the wild animals and all the domestic animals that were with him in the ark, and Elohim passed a wind over the earth, and the water decreased. And the fountains of the deep and the apertures of the skies were shut, and the water receded at the end of a hundred fifty days. And the ark rested in the seventh month, in the seventeenth day of the month, on the mountains of Ararat. And the water went on receding until the tenth month. In the tenth month, in the first of the month, the tops of the mountains appeared.
So where are these "fountains of the deep" and "apertures of the skies?" described in the P story? As Friedman notes, in the P Creation Myth a firmament separates waters above and below it. "The universe in that story is thus a habitable bubble surrounded by water. This same conception is assumed in the P flood story, in which the 'apertures of the skies' and the 'fountains of the great deep' are broken up so that the waters flow in."
To understand the different versions, one should look at the Friedman
Bible with Sources Revealed reference to see the two identified. Basically, you have two competing versions "stitched" together by a later redactor. This is why you have two difference sets of animals--for the P author, since you can only sacrifice centrally, you do not need all of those extra animals for sacrifice. For the J writer, you do.
Fortunately, I wrote out an explanation of the basics of the Documentary Hypothesis--which is, frankly, a fact, not a hypothesis--scholars argue about the dating and identity of the authors--for a [Blathering--Ed.] essay on the problems with the concept "ten commandments." Here is the explanation:
First, a brief introduction to whom the writers were according to Friedman's summary of the Documentary Hypothesis. His second source provides a nice summary of the arguments for multi-authorship in a 31-page introduction, whilst providing the texts of the Pentateuch divided into the authors. This makes seeing how the Redactor blended the J and P versions of the Flood Myth much easier, for example. I will not get into possible layers of authorship, though it appears that the main authors represent the work of individuals rather than committees or schools. D is usually divided into two authors, and Friedman argues for the same author writing at different periods. Friedman details theories on the dates for these authors in his references.
J: is the "Jahwist" author, known for his use of YHWH for the name of the deity. He never uses
Elohim, though individuals in the J stories may. Friedman demonstrates the connection between J and Judah which I will not summarize for space.
E: is the "Eloist" author, known for his use of
Elohim for the name of the deity. "Elohim" is actually plural--"gods"--and while the traditions may preserve truly polytheistic conceptions, by context the name refers to at least a deity more important than the others. Just to cause confusion, E will switch to YHWH after he appears to Moses and identifies himself as such. Friedman identifies E as a Shiloh Levite priest, possibly descended from the Mosaic line, named Bob [Stop that.--Ed.]. Right, again, he devotes about a chapter to the evidence for this.
D: is the Deutronomistic author, who, according to Friedman, writes a lot of the OT--Deuteronomy-Joshua-Judges-1 & 2 Samuel-1 & 2 Kings. He has similar attitudes as E--hates Aaronid priesthood: "In his introduction and conclusion to the book of Deuteronomy, he mentioned Aaron only twice: once to say that he died, and once to say that God was mad enough to destroy him in the matter of the golden calf." Long . . . long . . . long story short, Friedman suggests he is Jeremiah or, more likely, Jeremiah's scribe Baruch.
D generally uses JE, but does quote P to reverse P. For example, the book of Jeremiah contains quotes from P. It ". . . reverses the language of the P creation story, denies that God emphasized matters of sacrifices in the day that Israel left Egypt. Jeremiah knew the Priestly laws and stories. He did not like them, but he knew them."
P: is the "Priestly" author. He uses JE and follows the stories. Indeed, he uses
Elohim like E, though, according to Friedman, his style is so identifiable, he was easy to separate from E. Also, the "Elohim" stories have "doublets"--repeated material--which suggests two authors. Friedman identifies him as an Aaronid priest, or one serving their interests. P promotes Aaron and diminishes Moses:
P was written as an alternative to JE. The JE stories regularly said: "And Yahweh said unto Moses. . . ." But the author of P often made it: "And Yahweh said unto Moses and unto Aaron. . . ."
Again, Friedman goes into detail. Here is a fun one for you Creation Fans:
. . . in the twin stories of the flood . . . the J version said that Noah took seven pairs of all the clean (i.e., fit for sacrifice) animals and one pair of the unclean animals on the ark. But P just said that it was two of every kind of animal. Why? Because, in J, at the end of the story Noah offers a sacrifice. He therefore needs more than two of each of the clean animals or his sacrifice would wipe out a species. In P's perspective, however, two sheep and two cows are enough because there will be no portrayals of sacrifices until the consecration of Aaron (Friedman, WWtB).
R: is the "Redactor" who put together the texts. Interestingly, he does not significantly "harmonize" the stories--removing repetitions or even conflicts--and contributes little "new" material.
Since some Liberal Scum Friend [Tm.--Ed.] has just joined me for beer, I am just going to paste-in this second detailed description that gives proposed dates for the authors:
J: is the "Jahwist" author, known for his use of YHWH for the name of the deity. He never uses
Elohim, though individuals in the J stories may. Friedman demonstrates the connection between J and Judah which I will not summarize for space. Friedman argues for a date
between 848 and 722 BCE based on textual evidence.
E: is the "Eloist" author, known for his use of
Elohim for the name of the deity. "Elohim" is actually plural--"gods"--and while the traditions may preserve truly polytheistic conceptions, by context the name refers to at least a deity more important than the others. Just to cause confusion, E will switch to YHWH after he appears to Moses and identifies himself as such. Friedman identifies E as a Shiloh Levite priest, possibly descended from the Mosaic line, named Bob [Stop that.--Ed.]. Right, again, he devotes about a chapter to the evidence for this. Since E wrote during the existence of Israel, Friedman dates him to
between 922 and 722 BCE.
D: is the Deutronomistic author, who, according to Friedman, writes a lot of the OT--Deuteronomy-Joshua-Judges-1 & 2 Samuel-1 & 2 Kings. He has similar attitudes as E--hates Aaronid priesthood: "In his introduction and conclusion to the book of Deuteronomy, he mentioned Aaron only twice: once to say that he died, and once to say that God was mad enough to destroy him in the matter of the golden calf." D is actually two histories. The first,
Dtr1 was written during the reign of King Josiah of Judah at
about 622 BCE. The second,
Dtr2, was written during the exile following the Babylonian destruction of Jerusalem and the Second Temple in
587 BCE. While scholars generally consider these to be the product of "Deuteronomistic schools," Friedman argues for a single author.Long . . . long . . . long story short, Friedman suggests he is Jeremiah or, more likely, Jeremiah's scribe Baruch.
D generally uses JE, but does quote P to reverse P. For example, the book of Jeremiah contains quotes from P. It ". . . reverses the language of the P creation story, denies that God emphasized matters of sacrifices in the day that Israel left Egypt. Jeremiah knew the Priestly laws and stories. He did not like them, but he knew them."
P: is the "Priestly" author. He uses JE and follows the stories. Indeed, he uses
Elohim like E, though, according to Friedman, his style is so identifiable, he was easy to separate from E. Also, the "Elohim" stories have "doublets"--repeated material--which suggests two authors. Friedman identifies him as an Aaronid priest, or one serving their interests. P promotes Aaron and diminishes Moses
References:
Friedman RE.
Who Wrote the Bible?. 2nd Ed. San Francisco: Harper Collins, 1997.
Friedman RE.
The Bible with Sources Revealed. San Francisco: Harper Collins, 2003.
