pre clovis america

[marduk]

apparently compared to you I know everything
youre completely witless and you pretend at intelligence
your previous post was a personal attack
kind of proves you have nothing further to add
if you can't say anything on topic why don't yopu just shut up
no one wants to hear the uneducated crap you come out with anyway
you're what 50 years old and you don't know anything and you accuse people who do of being in some secret global conspiracy club
youre laughable you really are

[Beagle]

Now there's the Marduk I was looking for!! Have another drink, and I'll have you hurling every insult in the book shortly. You're easy.

I didn't realize how easy though until I saw RK kick your ass.

[marduk]

see there you go again
anything at all to add to this topic
run out of steam have you old man
want another ass kicking then you just carry on

[Beagle]

Does that English dictionary you use say anything about punctuation and capitalization?

[marduk]

see there you go again
anything at all to add to this topic
run out of steam have you old man
want another ass kicking then you just carry on

[Beagle]

Last night you showed everyone what you are like when you're drunk. You obviously have not gone back and read it. You made a complete fool out of yourself.

[john]

where does it say that the solutrean technique is identical to clovis
did i miss something ?

a couple three points (no pun intended) in no particular order.

solutrean points were largish, long, and very thin compared to their surface dimensions. previous points were way thicker. the diifferentials in techne which allowed this were two. the stone was literally cooked (although this is in some dispute), changing its temper (as in steel) and having changed the temper the solutreans mastered the cross flaking technique, in which a flake was lifted off most or all of the breadth of the point, at a recognizable angle to the longitudinal centerline of the point. this results in an instantly identifiable point, for the simple reason that the difference between solutrean points and percussion flaked points is as obvious as the difference between a ferrari and a vw bug. another thing, solutrean points were generally attached to foreshafts made of mammoth tusk split, heat treated to straighten, and then abraded into a graceful tapered cylindric shaft, which had a tapered face cut at one end to accept the point. the tapered face was roughened or crosshatched to provide a frictional surface for attachment of the point. finally, the solutreans had the habit of burying caches of way oversized "art" (for lack of a better word) points for which spectacular pieces of mother stone had been selected, along with bundles of foreshafts, often with the accompaniment of red ochre. the meaning of this practise is unknown.

clovis people are identical, item to item, in these particulars.


john

[Beagle]

Sorrry John, this isn't fair to you. I'll back away and maybe take it up on another thread. Pardon

[marduk]

its not fair on anyone.
i asked John a question and then you butted in with your usual crap
piss off eh

[john]

back in high school, the usual challenge ran this way.

"i'll meet you out at the bike racks in ten minutes. so get your ass out there and practice falling down".

john

[marduk]

clovis people are identical, item to item, in these particulars.

i see what you're saying John
but these similarities don't neccesarily mean they were the same people
what genetic evidence is there that backs up that the clovis and solutrean were the same

i could give you dozens of examples of even more similar coincedences than this (in fact its my speciality) but all it proves at the end of the day is that they were all the product of the same human ingenuity when the same materials were presented

Cognito should have a better answer to this than my scepticism
hes rather an expert in points of all description

[Beagle]

You wouldn't know anything about butting in on a conversation would you?
Isn't that the first thing you did when you first posted here? Now that's hypocritical.

[john]

clovis people are identical, item to item, in these particulars.

i see what you're saying John
but these similarities don't neccesarily mean they were the same people
what genetic evidence is there that backs up that the clovis and solutrean were the same

i could give you dozens of examples of even more similar coincedences than this (in fact its my speciality) but all it proves at the end of the day is that they were all the product of the same human ingenuity when the same materials were presented

Cognito should have a better answer to this than my scepticism
hes rather an expert in points of all description

i would say that, statistically, this would be damned unlikely, given the fact that we have no evidence of written language or other abstract ways of communicating accumulated knowledge. in other words, i learned to flake points from books and by practice, not from my father or other males of the group. so i'm running on the theory that this knowledge was passed on face to face for tens of thousands of years. this is easy to assimilate, intellectually, when you are dealing with, say, the chronology and physical evidence of the iberian peninsula. it gets much more difficult when you jump continents. but the only other means, however unlikely, is there was another abstract, or symbolic - and effective - way of passing learning and knowledge from people to people widely separated by culture, time and geographical location.

but i would still like to see your examples.


john


ps

the only other theory is that if you put enough monkeys on enough typewriters, one of them will write the entire corpus of shakespeare's work. maxwell's demon, in short.


j

[marduk]

well take for instance the boats of lake titicaca built from a design from the common era around 500ace

compare with the designs of sumerian boats from 3000bce

both made from reeds
both made with a high prow and stern
both made with a dragon head
but on opposite sides of the world
and with 3500 years seperation in time
the sumerians never made it as far as south america
but because of similarities like this a lot of people think they did
when you look into it you can find tonnes of other things that seem to add up
like the name Titicaca itself. it translates nicely in sumerian to "many river mouths". Titicaca itself is fed by 25 rivers
etc
etc


but it isn't evidence of anything except human ingenuity and a shortage of any other materials to make boats out of and the flexibility of ancient languages compared to primitive ones

[Cognito]

I wrote:

The second trip? Following the last group of people who went over the horizon, fishing along the way. A one-way trip, traveling east seems quite plausable.

Minimalist wrote:

That implies some sort of cultural affinity between groups that, I don't think, has been established yet.

Actually, I wasn't referring to disparate cultures or groups, but the same one. No problem on cultural affinity there.