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Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 2:27 pm
by Beagle
Talking politics is pretty volatile Dig. People feel pretty passionately.
I intend to analyze the race as best I can, realizing that most people don't know a lot about demographics, campaign finance, and political machinery.
To help out, let me say that the Democrat party was once a noble one and the Republican party was formed after they dropped the ball. Most people don't know that they were the party that favored slavery, and after the Civil War, it was Dems in the South that formed the KKK. That is not the case now, I hasten to add.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of ... atic_Party
Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 2:30 pm
by Beagle
The founding fathers represent a different generation Beag, it is unlikely that what ever their thoughts were on the matter, that they would be acceptable to you and yours now.
Read the papers sometime Digit. They spoke of universal and timeless principles. I agree with them very much.
Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 2:40 pm
by Digit
Point me in the right direction Beag, after all, this is history, the reason for this forum.
Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 2:49 pm
by Beagle
You can just google the Jefferson papers Dig, and get many links. They are housed at the library of Congress.
If you read them, you're going to know more about the American Dream than most Americans.
From the Library of Congress:
http://memory.loc.gov/ammem/collections ... on_papers/
Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 2:57 pm
by Digit
Thanks Beag. Provided there is no last minute cancellation I'm returning to hospital tomorrow afternoon so I'll be off the hook for, hopefully, not more that 24 hrs.
The papers will give me something to do when I'm back.
Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 3:02 pm
by Beagle
Get well and stay well Dig. I'll be thinking of you.
I must go act as if I've been productive today. Wife is home.
Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 3:20 pm
by Digit
Coward!
Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 4:01 pm
by Minimalist
Meanwhile....McCain is now in favor of torture.
http://apnews.excite.com/article/200802 ... A1EG1.html
YELLOW SPRINGS, Ohio (AP) - Republican presidential candidate John McCain said President Bush should veto a measure that would bar the CIA from using waterboarding and other harsh interrogation methods on terror suspects.
McCain voted against the bill, which would restrict the CIA to using only the 19 interrogation techniques listed in the Army field manual.
His vote was controversial because the manual prohibits waterboarding - a simulated drowning technique that McCain also opposes - yet McCain doesn't want the CIA bound by the manual and its prohibitions.
I think senility is setting in.
McCain
Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 4:56 pm
by Cognito
Meanwhile....McCain is now in favor of torture.
Wasn't McCain tortured in VietNam? And he favors the CIA using similar techniques?
Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 5:22 pm
by Minimalist
He has to wrap up the pro-torture wing of the Republican party.
I think the wheels have fallen off the "Straight Talk Express."
Re: McCain
Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 5:27 pm
by MichelleH
Cognito wrote:Meanwhile....McCain is now in favor of torture.
Wasn't McCain tortured in VietNam? And he favors the CIA using similar techniques?
McCain can hardly raise his arms above his head as a result of 'treatment' he received at the Hanoi Hilton.
But, he has definitely drank the Bush Kool-Aid on Iraq and foreign policy.
Being a 24 hour news junkie (CNBC, CNN, Fox, LA Times, NY Times, etc., etc.,etc.), I'm not thrilled with anything I see so far. My husband believes I need to back off or my head is going to explode....
Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 5:36 pm
by Beagle
Meanwhile....McCain is now in favor of torture.
"I was on the record as saying that they could use additional techniques as long as they were not cruel, inhumane and degrading treatment," McCain said. "So the vote was in keeping with my clear record of saying that they could have additional techniques, but those techniques could not violate" international rules against torture.
Min, you're ready for Wolf Blitzers job.
Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 5:54 pm
by Minimalist
His vote was controversial because the manual prohibits waterboarding - a simulated drowning technique that McCain also opposes - yet McCain doesn't want the CIA bound by the manual and its prohibitions.
McCain isn't smart enough to try to split hairs like that.
Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 6:10 pm
by Beagle
Oh c'mon Min. The article is very clear. You're completely distorting it.
McCain has never favored torture.
Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 7:09 pm
by Minimalist
Unless the CIA uses it.
I guess when we do it, it isn't torture?