Archaeologica.org

john wrote:
The word I'd use is teleological.

Best example I can think of is, you are out there hunting with bow and arrow. A deer breaks loose from cover and you aim, not at the point the deer is NOW (you will surely miss) but at the point the deer will be in the future. In short, you are aiming your arrow and releasing it into empty space which you predict will be occupied by the dee

john

kbs2244 wrote:In spite of myself, I am getting drawn into this.

A growing volume of evidence concerning Egyptian border defenses, desert sites where the fleeing Israelites supposedly camped, etc., indicates that the flight from Egypt ....never occurred at all...

...Beginning in the 1950s, doubts concerning the Book of Exodus multiplied just as they had about Genesis. The most obvious concerned the complete silence in contemporary Egyptian records concerning the mass escape of what the Bible says were no fewer than 603,550 Hebrew slaves. Such numbers no doubt were exaggerated. Yet considering how closely Egypt's eastern borders were patrolled at that time, how could the chroniclers of the day have failed to mention what was still likely a major security breach?

Not only was there a dearth of physical evidence concerning the escape itself, as archaeologists pointed out, but the slate was blank concerning the nearly five centuries that the Israelites had supposedly lived in Egypt prior to the Exodus as well as the forty years that they supposedly spent wandering in the Sinai.

Not so much as a skeleton, campsite, or cooking pot had turned up ...even though "modern archeological techniques are quite capable of tracing even the very meager remains of hunter-gatherers and pastoral nomads all over the world." Indeed, although archaeologists have found remains in the Sinai from the third millennium B.C. and the late first, they have found none from the thirteenth century.

Forum Monk wrote: When the age shifted to pisces, why didn't the followers begin sacrificing fish?

Who would do such a thing?

Interesting, yes. But I have said it before, I am an archaeo-astrono-skeptic.

Minimalist wrote:Shit. I'm starting to feel like Marduk with all the Sumerian b.s.

Babylon


2350 BC

Akkadians record solar & lunar eclipses according to tablets of Sargon of Akkad. Sargon summarizes astrological records of his era into 70 tablets. His heirs add their findings to this data base and call it the Namman-Bel.

2000 BC

Sumeria is replaced by Babylonia. Babylonian astrologers introduce zodiac signs and devise more accurate astronomical calculations.

1250 BC

Rameses II fixes 4 cardinal points using Aries, Cancer, Libra and Capricorn.

1200 BC

Babylonian Boundary stones contain much astrological imagery

700 BC

Babylonian priests create ecliptic divided into 12 30-degree sections or zodiac divisions (Mul.APIN).

670 BC

King Assurbanipal of Assyria expands astrological library in Ninevah.


Greece


600 BC

Babylonian astrology spreads to Egypt Greece and other parts of Middle East.

535 BC

Pythagoras sets up esoteric colony near Crotona in southern Italy where scholars learn about numerology, astrology and the occult arts, which Pythagoras learned during his 20 years of travels in Babylon and Egypt.

475 BC

Empedocles of Agrigentum introduces the 4 elements, Fire, Earth, Air and Water, into astrology, as the 4-fold root of all things. He discovered the idea that nothing can be destroyed (or created) only transformed.

420 BC

Democritus popularizes astrology for all. Xeno founder of the Stoics, gives zodiac signs Greek names.

409 BC

Date of oldest Babylonian horoscope.

380 BC

Babylonians begin to use 19 year cycle.

370 BC

Eudoxus of Cnidus devises calendars using zodiac with 12 equal zodiac signs. Invents geometrical theory of proportion.

350 BC

Petosiris, chief administrator of the Temple of Khumunu (Hermes) near Hermopolis becomes known for mastering egyptian esoteric astrology.

330 BC

Alexander the Great (356-323 BC) helps to spread astrology from Babylon and Egypt throughout the Middle East.

Greek Philosophers exposed to new occult ideas from Egypt and Babylon. Astrology is personalized in Greece.

Alexander founds Library of Alexandria.

300 BC

Greek model of Astrology reaches India.

290 BC

Alexandria in Egypt becomes center of astrological research. Eratosthenes, Arristyllus and Timocharis are its leading astrologers.

280 BC

Berosus, a Chaldean astrologer and priest of Bel Marduk at Babylon moves to Greek island of Cos where he sets up a school of astrology for Greek astrologers. Berosus writes The Babylonica, an enormous work about the history of astrology and life in Babylonia. He writes The Eye of Bel, based on the 70 tablets in the library of Assurbanipal, and uses it as text to teach Greek astrologers.

275 BC

The famous poem Phainomena written by Aratus in 275 BC further popularizes astrology and becomes common reading material for generations of Greeks.

250 BC

Antipatrus and Achinapolus continue the work of Berosus at Cos and teach medical astrology. They are the first astrologers to experiment with the moment of conception rather than birth for the casting of a horoscope.

220 BC

First known picture of zodiac in Egypt is created north of Esna.


Rome

200 BC

Predictive astrology spreads to Rome.

150 BC

Esoteric form of astrology based on the teachings of Hermes or Thoth circulates in numerous works under such titles as: Astrologoumena, Hermaikai Diataxeis or Doctrines of Hermes, Apokotastasis, Liber Hermetis, Asklepios.

135 BC

Posidonius brings astrology to Roman intellectuals.

130 BC

Greek astronomer Hipparchus is credited for the discovering the precession of the equinoxes which was already known in Babylonia centuries earlier. (my bolding)

100 BC

Essenes develop Qabbalah and esoteric astrology.

60 BC

Nigidius Figulus starts first school of astrology in Rome and publishes books on astrological prediction. The Georgics of Virgil constitute astrological almanacs.

20 BC

Roman Emperor Augustus has coins stamped with his sign Capricorn.

7 BC

Three Wise Men or Magi from the East (astrologers from Chaldea or Persia) predict birth of Messiah (Jesus Christ) according to Gospels of New Testament.



17

Egyptian zodiac at Denderah is erected.

50

Astrology has prominent role in Roman literature such as in The Tragedies of Seneca and Thyestes. Fourth Roman Emperor Claudius becomes versed in astrology. In his reign, Rome is caught up in a frenzy of astrology.

117

Roman Emperor Hadrian, also an astrologer, casts his own horoscope and consults it regularly.

150

Ptolemy writes The Tetrabiblos, the most comprehensive work on astrology to date. Already aware of the precession of the equinoxes, Ptolemy cautions astrologers to use the tropical spring equinox as the start of the first zodiac sign. Other astrologers such as Hephaestion of Thebes and Julius Firmicus use it as seminal work.

188

Vettius Valens of Antioch, well-known astrologer amasses fine library of horoscopes and analyzes 100 in his Anthologiae.

222

Alexander Serverus sets up teaching posts in astrology which are subsidized by the imperial budget.

250

Plotinus declares that astrology indicates a possible future but does not shape it.

400

Library of Alexandria is destroyed with loss of many astrology texts.

450

Proclus writes paraphrase of Ptolemy's Tetrabiblos.

476

Astrology declines in Europe with the Fall of the Roman Empire.

The earliest copy of the text so far discovered was made in 686 BCE, however the majority of scholars now believe that the text was originally compiled anywhere between 1400 and 1000 BCE. [1] The latest copies of Mul-Apin are currently dated to around 300 BCE.

kbs2244 wrote:Ishtar:
My point was that Job was not a Hebrew.
And that I don't think you can use the book of Job as a dateing base.
There may have been some time between the stories occurance and it's being written down.

kbs2244 wrote:OK, I will go back to the sidelines.
I went back and re-read you mention of The Book of Job.
You weren’t talking about the time of it’s occurrence, but about the time of it’s being written down?

Ishtar wrote:

john wrote:
The word I'd use is teleological.

Best example I can think of is, you are out there hunting with bow and arrow. A deer breaks loose from cover and you aim, not at the point the deer is NOW (you will surely miss) but at the point the deer will be in the future. In short, you are aiming your arrow and releasing it into empty space which you predict will be occupied by the dee

john

Yes, except John, the deer/arrow example doesn't work in this case because non-ordinary reality (NOR) - which is what we've been trained to call this extra dimensionary place - is beyond time and space! So you'd need to fire your arrow at where the deer is now, not in a nanosecond's time.

I came up with the word 'television' partly to make a point - that it can be like a shared experience of watching a tv programme that's being beamed simultaneously all over the world. But I chose it also partly because journeying can be compared to the seeing referred to in the word 'seer', which is what some of the ancient prophets were called because they could see into the future.

In the case of the shamanic journey, you are seeing, but not into the future. You're seeing (and hearing, and smelling, and touching, and tasting) into an extra dimension of the here and now.

So based on that new information, see if you can come up with a more appropriate word!

john wrote:
Returning is the motion of the Tao.
Yielding is the way of the Tao.
Ten thousand things are born of being.
Being is born of not being.

-from the Tao Te Ching

john

The point of interest for these early astronomers seems to have been the projected end date in 2012 A.D., rather than the beginning date in 3114 B.C.

Having determined the end date in 2012 (for reasons we will come to shortly), and calling it 13.0.0.0.0, they thus proclaimed themselves to be living in the 6th baktun of the Great Cycle.

The later Maya certainly attributed much mythological significance to the beginning date, relating it to the birth of their deities, but it now seems certain that the placement of the Long Count hinges upon its calculated end point.

Why did early Mesoamerican skywatchers pick a date some 2300 years into the future and, in fact, how did they pinpoint an accurate winter solstice? With all these considerations one begins to suspect that, for some reason, the ancient New World astronomers were tracking precession.

I have concluded that even cultures with simple horizon astronomy and oral records passed down for a hundred years or so, would notice the slow shifting of the heavens.

For example, imagine that you lived in an environment suited for accurately demarcated horizon astronomy. Even if this wasn't the case, you might erect monoliths to sight the horizon position of, most likely, the dawning winter solstice sun.

This position in relation to background stars could be accurately preserved in oral verse or wisdom teachings, to be passed down for centuries. Since precession will change this position at the rate of 1 degree every 72 years, within the relatively short time of 100 years or so, a noticeable change will have occurred. The point of this is simple. To early cultures attuned to the subtle movements of the sky, precession would not have been hard to notice.