Upheavals in the Third Millennium BCE De Novo

[MichelleH]

From Forum Monk:

Some discussion was begun on other threads relating to the seeming simultaneous emergence of megalithic building, great monuments, mighty civilizations and their subsequent collapse and a possible great migration period all within the general time frame of the third millenium BCE.

Caucasian Dolmens
Carnac stones of france
Newgrange, Stonehenge, and Avebury
White pyramid of China
Pyramid of Hellinikon
Pyramids of Egypt
Ziggurats of Mesopotamia

Many scholars have concluded that the late 3rd millenium was a time of upheavals and catastrophes and many explanations have been offered:

Biblical flood
Comet impact
Volcano
Climate change

I would like to initiate some discussion of this time period by posting some theories (one at a time) and see what kind of opinions exist.

[Minimalist]

Biblical flood
Comet impact
Volcano
Climate change

1- Biblical Flood. There is no evidence for any such world wide catastrophe. There may have been local floods at scattered locations.

2- A comet big enough to create a world wide catastrophe would have made some impression, one would think, in the Egyptian and Sumerian records of the time.

3- In the Middle East? Santorini exploded in the middle of the second millenium and while doubtlessly catastrophic it did not even obliterate the Bronze Age cultures in the region.

4- There is evidence of climate change in various regions but later in the Second Millenium rather than earlier in the case of Egypt. By the end of the Old Kingdom the pyramids were already built.

What else is there?

[Forum Monk]

I will post a review later this evening - but in the meantime if any one else wants to start off, go ahead.

[Cognito]

Biblical flood
Comet impact
Volcano
Climate change

I agree with Min. There is no evidence during the period for any world wide catastrophe, climactic or otherwise, with the exception of the 2,200bce event which is well characterised in the Greenland and Vostok ice core records.

[Beagle]

http://personal.eunet.fi/pp/tilmari/tilmari2.htm

This author seems to think that there were catastrophic events all over the place at that time.

[Minimalist]

Egypt and Sumer seem to have been hit by drought.

Even today, in subsistence regions like north Africa we see the almost immediate results of a lack of rainfall. No rain = famine = political instability = violence. In situations where there is no international outcry or relief effort the results of this situation are as dire as they are predictable.

Our civilization is a thin veneer which can quickly dissolve under stress.

[Digit]

But why start building massive structures? Is it the result of what ever happened or a response to a new way of life?
If people were displaced it would seem that actual reason would be food shortages, what ever the cause, so they move. Fine, but why now expend so much effort in building?
Our thinking doesn't merge with theirs I fear.

[Forum Monk]

http://personal.eunet.fi/pp/tilmari/tilmari2.htm

This author seems to think that there were catastrophic events all over the place at that time.

Exactly. That post was one of my first on the previous thread. For those not inclind to look, the author attempts to find a cause for the following events all timed in the 2200-2100 time frame:

Egypt - collapse of the old kingdom and the entry top the first intermediate period.

Sumer - the fall of the kindom of Akkad and the end of the Sargon dynasty.

Anatolia - evidence of wide spread destruction including the Troy IIg stratum. A meter thick layer of ash and charred remains.

Mesopotamia - evidence of abrupt climate change in core samples taken at lake Van

Palestine - Abrupt change in the level of the Dead Sea (100 meter drop).

Nile - low lake level of Lake Turkana during this period

Indus Valley - dramatic decrease in the area of evergreen forests

West Asia - abrupt drop in the level of pollens for in lake cores.

so on...

The author presents evidence of a climate change induced by a comet which broke up and struck earth around 2200bce.

[Forum Monk]

But why start building massive structures? Is it the result of what ever happened or a response to a new way of life?
If people were displaced it would seem that actual reason would be food shortages, what ever the cause, so they move. Fine, but why now expend so much effort in building?
Our thinking doesn't merge with theirs I fear.

That is a good question. Why, indeed. KBS2244 presented some evidence of a disaster circa 2800bce. above I have summarized an authors case for 2200bce.

The original purpose of this thread, in spite of its name was to determine if a commonality existed as to why there appears to be a mass migration in the 3rd millenium (or more like before) and why the sudden building craze. I have some ideas of my own but I am still developing them.

[Minimalist]

Again, the building craze was largely complete by the time of the supposed catastrophe c 2200 BC.

Why not ask if mega building project cause climate change?

[Forum Monk]

I agree with you. I am not linking the climate change of 2200 with buildings. And to be accurate, the building boom did not occur within the space of a few decades either. There were phases in which different methods and materials were used. Earth works, brick works, stone works, occuring as earlier than 3500 to as late at 1500 and in some case even later.

Here are some examples in the British Isles:

Newgrange - earthworks built about 3000bce
Stonehenge - woodworks - built around 3100bce
Stonehenge - megalithic - built around 2400bce
Avebury - earthworks - about 3000bce
Avebury - stoneworks - about 2600bce

[Cognito]

Newgrange - earthworks built about 3000bce

Monk, it is my understanding that Newgrange was built circa. 3500bce. I have been there and can attest to the impressive nature of its construction as an astrological marker. There are other unexcavated mounds in the area that could be just as impressive. Regardless, I believe that the concerted effort in Ireland predates the 3rd Millenium phenomenon that we are discussing.

The 2200bce climactic event is very well represented in the geological record and may have involved significant areas around the globe. However, I don't see much else to write home about during that millenium:


As granny said in the commercial:

[Forum Monk]

Newgrange is C14 dated to 3300-2900. Lets say 3100 then?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newgrange

[Forum Monk]

The stone pyramids of Egypt - approx build dates based on radiocarbon dating (1995)
Djoser - 2630-2611
Gizamids - 2551 - 2472
5th dynasty pyramids 2465 - 2323
6th dynasty pyramids 2323 - 2150
MK pyramids 2040 - 1640

So much for the climate change of 2200, eh?

[Minimalist]

Most of the post Giza pyramids are little more than piles of rubble.


Pyramid of Unas