Archaeologica.org

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060907/sc_ ... ization_dc

Here's a subject that has been brought up and discussed in many threads. Climate change is becoming recognized as a major factor in the formation of civilization.

As the climate became steadily drier formerly nomadic people were forced to come together for mutual support and to eke out the dwindling natural resources.

I wonder if he suggesting that nomads became farmers in times of drought...or did they simply remain different types of nomads? The article could use a lot more depth.

As the climate became steadily drier formerly nomadic people were forced to come together for mutual support and to eke out the dwindling natural resources.

But not all of the consequences of this merging movement were beneficial -- social inequality arose as did organized violence, there was no increase in life expectancy and autocratic governments emerged, Brooks said.

When climate conditions improved again there was no return to the former order.

"Once the cat is out of the bag, it doesn't go back. You can't uninvent technology," Brooks said

i would have a problem here as i don't think it was technology that persuaded the nomads to stop roaming, (since we still have nomads today) but i would suggest that it was becoming comfortable that did the trick.

plus because we have nomads today i can't agree that the drier climate changed their lifestyle at all. present day wanderers do so in the desert so that kind of undermines that point.

archaeologist wrote:

As the climate became steadily drier formerly nomadic people were forced to come together for mutual support and to eke out the dwindling natural resources.

But not all of the consequences of this merging movement were beneficial -- social inequality arose as did organized violence, there was no increase in life expectancy and autocratic governments emerged, Brooks said.

When climate conditions improved again there was no return to the former order.

"Once the cat is out of the bag, it doesn't go back. You can't uninvent technology," Brooks said

i would have a problem here as i don't think it was technology that persuaded the nomads to stop roaming, (since we still have nomads today) but i would suggest that it was becoming comfortable that did the trick.

plus because we have nomads today i can't agree that the drier climate changed their lifestyle at all. present day wanderers do so in the desert so that kind of undermines that point.

all missed the fundamental point. walmart.

j

http://news.independent.co.uk/environme ... 603667.ece

Arctic meltdown is speeding up... sea ice is vanishing faster than ever before... polar bears face extinction... and America's top climate scientist warns we only have a decade to save the planet

From the Daily Grail

and America's top climate scientist warns we only have a decade to save the planet

But George W. says to keep buying Hummers!

Well, they do say our distant ancestors came down from the trees becauise of climate change. And we started forming cities because of climate change.

The Roman Empire rose in a period of warmer climate, and collapsed when a cold period set in. When the warmth returned we had the Rennaisance. The Little Ice Age coincided with the Agricultural and Industrial revolutions.

Climate change always seems to lead to changes in human society, usually for the better ...

btw don't rely too much on media reports with regards current climate change ... they always quote out of context or else don't give the whole story. That's not to say it isn't happening, or isn't a problem - just that it's always advisable to find the source of the story, rather than rely on the story itself.

Arctic meltdown is speeding up... sea ice is vanishing faster than ever before... polar bears face extinction... and America's top climate scientist warns we only have a decade to save the planet

amazing, a documentery on polar bears shownon the discovery channel did not list that as a date at all. it said we had about 100 years before the polar bears went extinct, not lose the planet.

i do not think it was climate that was the culprit, that is more of a scapegoat for the nations not fulfilling their responsibilities and managing their resources properly.

not stocking up enough supplies to combat the cold is not a climate error or influence but a human one.

Climate change always seems to lead to changes in human society, usually for the better

that has never been the case at all.

[quote]amazing, a documentery on polar bears shownon the discovery channel did not list that as a date at all. it said we had about 100 years before the polar bears went extinct, not lose the planet. [/quote]

I think the decade that was referred to means that is how long we have to stop the downward spiral before it's to late to stop it.

[quote]i do not think it was climate that was the culprit, that is more of a scapegoat for the nations not fulfilling their responsibilities and managing their resources properly. [/quote]

Yes the climate is the culprit, but only because we humans have managed to make a mess of things by screwing up the natural cycle. We have tried to control nature and it just can't be done. Somehow or other nature will find a way to take back what belongs to her. You guys may to too young to remember the old TV ad for margerine -- "It's not nice to fool Mother Nature."

You guys may to too young to remember the old TV ad for margerine -- "It's not nice to fool Mother Nature."

no i remember those ads, cute.

Yes the climate is the culprit, but only because we humans have managed to make a mess of things by screwing up the natural cycle

then nature can't be the culprit if humans messed things up.

Humans are ultimately the culprits, nature is just reacting to the conditions we have made.

Humans are ultimately the culprits, nature is just reacting to the conditions we have made

okay agreed but that raises another question; i understand that since the industrial revolution that is so but what did the ancient world do to disrupt culture which then forced the people to move to a different area?

it is only natural that when people have had enough of a disasteral climatic situation that they would move. If anything good can come from the katrina experience is this point. when people have had enough of hurricanes, volcanoes, and other repititive natural occurances, they move.

the reaction to katrina in new orleans may offer an explanation for the lack of skeletons and domestic evidence on Thera. that just vefore the final explosion of of santorini, the people packed up and moved.

we know this is a possibility because a mass of people moved from New Orleans and relocated in other areas.

so i am of the opinion that this idea is not impressive nor unnatural but that is is a normal part of daily living whether in the ancient or modern world.

The ice has been melting since the last ice-age.

There have been past ice-ages, and global warmings.
(were these influenced by man and industry?..no).

I will not go as far as to say industry has nothing to contribute to global warming. I will say that global warming is going to take place anyways. We are just seeing towards the end of the melt that started some 10,000 years ago or so..

And a new iceage could begin after that.

The fact that global warming is leading to a catastrophic future is not just the opinion of a few scientists .It has been established trough various computer generated scenarios .Every new calculation only finetunes the scenario or adds parameters to it .
Like global dimming which was discovered subsequent to 9/11 when the aircraft traffic was halted above the US .
I think it merits more attention than just opposing it without scientific backup .Too much is at stake .

ReneDescartes wrote:Like global dimming which was discovered subsequent to 9/11 when the aircraft traffic was halted above the US .
.

global dimming???

never heard that term, anyone care to give me a clue?