Olmec culture

[Beagle]

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/14/scien ... ref=slogin

A stone slab found in the state of Veracruz in Mexico bears 3,000-year-old writing previously unknown to scholars, according to archaeologists who say it is an example of the oldest script ever discovered in the Western Hemisphere.

Click the picture in the article to enlarge. Much about Olmecs to put here.

[bandit]

for those of us who are not registered on beagles linkhere is another one.

I think it is stating pretty much the same thing.

[bandit]

This is a rather old article but it raises a question, for me at least.

The following excerpts are from the linked source:

Archaeologists uncovered the cylinder and fingernail-sized fragments among debris from an ancient festival at San Andres, an Olmec town on the coastal plain of the Mexican state of Tabasco.


The cylinder shows two glyphs linked by lines to the mouth of a bird, giving the impression the glyphs are being spoken. One is "ajaw," meaning "king," and the other "three ajaw", a day in the sacred 260-day calendar used throughout the region for over a millennium.


Pohl says that writing could have originated at the start of the first Olmec culture in 1300 BC, but no evidence has survived.

Now, perhaps I'm misreading this but it seem like a contradiction.

[Guest]

The ancient ancestors of the Mexicans said that they sailed to their land from across the ocean to the east, from the land they called Atlan, or Aztlan, so where do you supposed that was?

[Sam Salmon]

The ancient ancestors of the Mexicans said that they sailed to their land from across the ocean to the east, from the land they called Atlan, or Aztlan, so where do you supposed that was?

Link?
Mexico is a large complex country with a long complex past.
Blanket statement give a poor view of that tapestry.

[Guest]

Link? Just ask about any Mexican what is the name of their ancestral homeland.

[Sam Salmon]

Having lived in Mexico a number of times in the past 2 decades I can easily answer your question-a Mexican will answer with the name of his home town and state.

[Guest]

Okee dokey.

[DougWeller]

The ancient ancestors of the Mexicans said that they sailed to their land from across the ocean to the east, from the land they called Atlan, or Aztlan, so where do you supposed that was?

AZTLAN which is translated as ""the place of whiteness," or "the place of herons' see: D. Carrasco, ed. 2001. The Oxford Encyclopedia of Mesoamerican Cultures, vol.1, pp.72-72; or E. Seler. 1991 [1902-1903]. "where was Aztlan, the Home ofthe Aztecs?" in Collected Works in Mesoamerican Linguistics and Archaeology, vol 2:18-27. Culver City, CA: Labyrinthos.

But don't get carried away by 'place of whiteness'. "aztatl" is Nahuatl for herons or white-plumed birds. Aztec priests used white to symbolise origin, so it Aztlan might just mean 'place of origin'.

So, do we know where that might be? You could read E. Seler, which I haven't done. This might help:

http://web.ku.edu/~hoopes/aztlan/History.htm

and this, although you need to check anything from Wikipedia, it can be a good start: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aztl%C3%A1n
It says "The name of Aztalan, Wisconsin (a Mississippian site) was proposed by N. F. Hyer in 1837 because he thought it might have been Aztlán, following a suggested etymology of "Aztatlan" by Alexander von Humboldt.

In the mid-nineteenth century, fringe theorist Ignatius Donnelly, in his famous book Atlantis: The Antediluvian World, sought to establish a connection between Aztlán and the fabled "lost continent" of Atlantis of Greek mythology; Donnelly's views, however, have never been recognised as credible by mainstream scholarship.

In 1887, Mexican anthropologist Alfredo Chavero claimed that Aztlán was located on the Pacific coast in the state of Nayarit. While this was disputed by contemporary scholars, it achieved some popular acceptance. In the early 1980s, the Mexican President José López Portillo suggested that Mexcaltitlan, also in Nayarit, was the true location of Aztlán, but this was denounced by Mexican historians as a political move.[1] Even so, the state of Nayarit incorporated the symbol of Aztlán in their Coat of Arms with the legend "Nayarit, cradle of Mexicans".

Eduardo Matos Mocteuma presumes Aztlán to be somewhere in the modern day states of Guanajuato, Jalisco, and Michoacan. [2]

It has also been proposed that Lake Powell, Utah was originally the site of Aztlán. Part of the migration legend also describes a stay at Culhuacan ('leaning hill' or 'curved hill'). Proponents of the Lake Powell theory equate this Culhuacan with the ancient home of the Anasazi at Cliff Palace, Mesa Verde National Park, Arizona.[citation needed]"

[marduk]

nobody knows the place of Origin of the Meso and South american races except for national geographic
so don't bother looking for it
its already been found

[Guest]

Aztlan, Atlan, Attalan, Avalon, Atland, Atlantioi, Atlantes, hmmmm, and the Popol Vu says the ancient ancestors sailed across the eastern ocean when they came to Central America, very interesting. And don't forget Atl means Water (must be the water of Lake Powell).

[marduk]

well the popul vuh was heavily influenced by christianity
of course people who use it to make claims on it don't ever mention that

[Guest]

And please say why Christendom would foster the "myth" of Atlantis?

[marduk]

And please say why Christendom would foster the "myth" of Atlantis?

Atlantis - a civilisation destroyed by a god because they were sinful
The pre deluge world - a civilisation destroyed by a god because they were sinful

thats why
but thats besides the point
the Popul Vuh doesn't say anything about Atlantis whatsoever.
i think you've been reading a little too much into Grahams "Fingerpaints" fictional novel

[Guest]

The sailing from the east occurred after the Deluge in the Popol Vuh.

So they sailed from the east, atl means water, the homeland is atlan, my oh my.