Rock Art

stan · Post by **stan** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 5:47 pm

It would be nice to see a photo.
I googled for one yesterday without success.

marduk · Post by **marduk** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 5:54 pm

stan · Post by **stan** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 8:34 pm

Ah,yes. I saw that one, but I couldn't determine whether it was connected with the story or another one below it about a modern artist.

Also couldn't make out any mother and child imagery.

marduk · Post by **marduk** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 9:30 pm

i thought that at first as well i cant make out any detail in it at all
but its repeated at three other reports that I googled all directly linked with the text
i guess thats why its special
probably some nutty kid got loose with his dads ochre

clubs_stink · Post by **clubs_stink** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 11:34 pm

What about this rock art?

http://www.ancient-hebrew.org/15_loslunas.html

(I warned you I was an anarcheologist

)

I also never see any discussion here about the book America BC. I've read a lot and seen a lot of photos and tracings of these inscriptions ect...why doesn't anyone talk about them?

http://www.science-frontiers.com/sf113/sf113p01.htm

Beagle · Post by **Beagle** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 5:30 am

I warned you I was an anarcheologist

Cards - Dave Campbell has a nice site at Anarchaeology.com. Don't want you to leave us , but some members here post over there too.

marduk · Post by **marduk** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 12:52 pm

i hear thats abbreviated from Anal archaeology

clubs_stink · Post by **clubs_stink** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 11:27 pm

Beagle wrote:
I warned you I was an anarcheologist
Cards - Dave Campbell has a nice site at Anarchaeology.com. Don't want you to leave us , but some members here post over there too.

Yes, I know. I don't post anywhere but I read everywhere, that is until I got brave and registered here. I certainly have a lot of questions in my head.

What I don't understand is why these things are not discussed? I read a woman's site who was in some way associated with Fells and she wrote in great detail about her travels to some of these spots to document the odd carvings. Is it that it's just too strange, does not fit in with what "normal" people think? What are the implications of discussing what does not fit within the framework set up by "the club"? I'd think this place would be the very spot for the bright minds to sink their teeth into these oddities and explore them.

What is odd, is that this is a non-club "association" but in some ways it walks the line

not wanting to color TOO far outside the lines???

kbs2244 · Post by **kbs2244** » Sun Jan 21, 2007 11:15 am

Club-stink
You are quite correct in observing that no one wants to talk about Egyptians, Jews, and Romans in the American South West.
Los Lunas is just too good to be true, so it has to be false.
If you do a search on it you will find that a lot of local professionals know of it, think it is real, but don't talk about it.
The best quote I found about it was from an old local Indian elers. When asked by a local historian in the early 1800's if he knew anything about it, the elder said, "We know it is there. It was there when our people came. We don't go there."
All the astronomical knowledge shown in the rock art of the area is well beyond the knowledge of the local “Native” Americans, so it isn’t spoken about.
The lady you refer to is Gloria Farley and her book is titled “In Plain Sight.”
I believe it was self published, but you may be able to get a copy if you do a search on her name. She was an “amateur“, but a darn good one. Her problem was she stepped on the toes of the status quo crowd.
The best book of photos of SW rock art I have found is called “Images in Stone.”
This is a big, coffee table style book .The text is by Polly Schaafsma, and is not very inspiring. But the photos are by David Muench, and he is real good.
He dosn't do the sequencing of light across the art to show the coming events that Farley does, he looks at them from an artist's point of view. But the detail he shows is just great.

Post by **Minimalist** » Sun Jan 21, 2007 11:37 am

What I don't understand is why these things are not discussed?

Many archaeologists do not wish to risk committing professional suicide by getting on the wrong side of The Club. Read through the Pre-Clovis Iron Smelting and Hardaker threads.

That leaves discussion to "outsiders" who are promptly dismissed as such by the Establishment.

Digit · Post by **Digit** » Sun Jan 21, 2007 11:41 am

And all clubs have the same basic rule, if you're not in, you're out!

stan · Post by **stan** » Sun Jan 21, 2007 1:01 pm

First I've heard of this ten commandments boulder.
Is there a photo of it in situ? How big, etc.
Does the rock itself belong there?

Forum Monk · Post by **Forum Monk** » Sun Jan 21, 2007 1:07 pm

stan wrote:First I've heard of this ten commandments boulder.
Is there a photo of it in situ? How big, etc.
Does the rock itself belong there?

Check google...'los lunas petroglyphs' (or 'decalogue') there are several pictures of it undisturbed (or so it appears). The lettering is plainly visible (perhaps it has been enhanced). The rock is estimated at 60-100tons.

Post by **Minimalist** » Sun Jan 21, 2007 1:26 pm

Digit wrote:And all clubs have the same basic rule, if you're not in, you're out!

True, Digit, however as the late Art Buchwald once said:

“If you attack the establishment long enough and hard enough, they will make you a member of it.”

Forum Monk · Post by **Forum Monk** » Sun Jan 21, 2007 4:27 pm

About the Los Lunas petroglyph, I would like to inject this into the fray. Nobody would have more to gain than the Mormons if indeed, hewbrew script was found in North America to predate Columbus. And yet even the Mormons have not embraced the discovery:

http://members.aol.com/pooua/Hidden_Mou ... story.html

The book, "Mormonism - Shadow or Reality," written by Jerald and Sandra Tanner, provides the following excerpt from Welby W. Ricks, President of the University Archaeological Society at Brigham Young University:

"Many requests have come to me from time to time for information about a certain inscription on stone found near Los Lunas, New Mexico, which contains extracts from the Ten Commandments in a Phoenician script, which type of writing was in existence in Palestine during Leni's day around 600 B.C. To find such a script on stone in the New World is indeed interesting, but upon translation for it to contain the Ten Commandments seems almost incredible.
"To Latter-day Saints such a discovery would appear to agree with the Book of Mormon. But to accept such evidence at face value, i.e., without investigation, could be embarrassing to this Society as well as to the Latter-day Saint Church, especially if it were later shown to be fraudulent. Because of the position of the Church, we must exercise every caution, even greater-than-objective scholarship, if possible, to make sure any purported Hebrew (or Phoenician) writing found in the New World is genuine. ...
"It was in October, 1953, that a group of us -- Dr. Milton R. Hunter, Dr. Sidney B. Sperry, Dr. Hugh Nibley, Mr. (now Dr.) John L. Sorenson and myself -- got together and made a trip to New Mexico to investigate the inscription." (Fifteenth Annual Symposium on the Archaeology of the Scriptures, BYU, 1964, p. 94)
Welby W. Ricks goes on to tell of their investigation of the purported inscription (see Archaeology and the Book of Mormon, pp. 19-20) and concludes by stating:
"To conclude, I should like to list the evidences which make me believe the inscription is fraudulent:
"(1) The characters in the stone were too fresh. They did not have any patination. If they had been of ancient date there would have been some patination, and certainly there would have been some in those inscriptions on top of the mesa. One might argue that the Ten Commandments stone could have been covered up for centuries by sand, but the Phoenician inscriptions on top must surely be related to the one below. They also were without patination.
"(2) The finding of the words, 'Eva and Hobie, 3-13-30,' nearby, cut in the same size, depth, and freshness, is sufficient to create suspicion as to the origin of the Phoenician inscription.
"(3) The finding of the dust of freshly cut stone still in the grooving suggests very recent origin.
"(4) The making by the McCarts of an inscription in Phoenician characters on each of two stones to test for patination seems strange, indeed.
"(5) The obvious lying about finding another inscription, "Temple of Toni'; the finding of the entrance at one time and not another; the finding of gold in the temple and not taking any out to prove it; and, above all, not being able to find it again--all this is fantastic beyond humun [sic] limits of comprehension.
"(6) The admission by Bill McCart that they were doing this to get money to sponsor a search for treasure in the malpais (lava remains) area, where there was supposedly the possibility of finding Spanish gold.
"For these reasons and others I am fully convinced that the Ten Commandments stone found near Los Lunas, New Mexico, IS A FRAUD. Its age does NOT go back into ancient times. It is probably from thirty to fifty years old, perhaps even dating to as late as March 13, 1930." (Fifteenth Annual Symposium on the Archaeology of the Scriptures, pp. 99-100)
Quotation from Mormonism - Shadow or Reality. Enlarged Edition. Jerald and Sandra Tanner. Modern Microfilm Company, Salt Lake City, Utah. Pp 110 - 111. 1972.

Apparently the perpetrators signed their work