Texas Monkeys

Digit · Post by **Digit** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 3:43 pm

A dark era Monk, yes, but I have wondered in the past exactly how modern America, or others, would now handle a people like the Cheyenne.
After the battle at Rorkes Drift in South Africa the British survivors went round shooting and clubbing the Zulu wounded to death. One of their reasons was the Zulu would not normall surrender, and they were considered as savages because of their treatment of enemy dead.
They normally slit the abdomen open, their reason was not mistreatment, but they believed this released the dead man's soul.

Forum Monk · Post by **Forum Monk** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 4:33 pm

If I may continue off topic for a while, here is one point of view:
http://hnn.us/articles/7302.html

and:
http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v18/v18n2p24_Bruckner.html

Post by **Minimalist** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 8:03 pm

They normally slit the abdomen open, their reason was not mistreatment

Generally, reactions to that sort of behavior are more dependent on the reactions of the winners than the reasons of the losers.

The American Indians were dealt with harshly, no question. However. In 1756 they sided with the French against the British and did a fair share of raiding and burning themselves. In 1776, they sided with the British against the Americans and again, the frontier exploded.

Is it really so difficult to understand that by the time the tables were turned the early Americans were in no mood to cut these people any slack?

Digit · Post by **Digit** » Fri Apr 06, 2007 1:39 am

True Min, the Indians, like the Zulus, didn't observe European standards and they also lost.

Post by **Minimalist** » Fri Apr 06, 2007 9:14 am

Shepstone's treatment of the Zulu was about as provocative as one can get.

Digit · Post by **Digit** » Fri Apr 06, 2007 10:35 am

Standard procedure, get the natives to revolt, then crush them!

Post by **Minimalist** » Fri Apr 06, 2007 11:10 am

It's been a long time since I read "The Washing of the Spears" but my recollection is that they never did revolt. Shepstone issued an impossible ultimatum and then invaded when they did not roll over.

Isandlwana might almost have been "justice."

Forum Monk · Post by **Forum Monk** » Fri Apr 06, 2007 11:20 am

Kind of like the massacre at Wounded Knee. An unnecessary tragedy.

Digit · Post by **Digit** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 12:35 pm

Article in todays Daily Express about slavery. Apparently black slaves were introduced to the American colonies when we Brits ran out of white ones.
They rounded up all the homeless kids and sent to work on plantations and few survived for vary long and the supple ran out.
Doesn't make any mention of the fact that the socialist government of the UK after WW2 reintroduced the procedure though.
Wonder why?

Forum Monk · Post by **Forum Monk** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 12:49 pm

Many americans, today are here because of english oppression of the Scotts in the Bishop Wars and Cromwell's invasion in Scotland and Ireland in the mid 1600s. Many of those prisoners were sent to the new world colony to serve as prison laborers, a form of white slavery.

Fortunately, for them I suppose, many employers on this side gave them opportunity to work out their indentureships, or allowed others to simply disappear into the American landscape.

Digit · Post by **Digit** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 1:26 pm

In many ways Monk the Brit governments of the day did this country a great disservice as I may have posted before, (can't remember), the people they deported were some of our best.
Those who were prepared to stand up against the role pre-ordained for them and fight back, if only by stealing.
The first ship load of women transported to Australia prostituted themselves at every port and with the seamen, and arrived in Australia with money and an indepent mind, and many of them subsequently made good and became the 'founding mothers' of modern Australia.
They had nothing to be ashamed of, one of them was 12 yrs old!

Post by **Minimalist** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 1:41 pm

Reminds me of the old joke about Australia, Digit.

A guy goes up to Immigration at Sydney airport and the inspector asks:

"Do you have a criminal record?"

The guy replies: "I'm sorry....I didn't know that was still a requirement."

Digit · Post by **Digit** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 2:12 pm

Must remember that one!

Frank Harrist · Post by **Frank Harrist** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 10:26 pm

Hey guy's! I don't have time to say much. I just read this entire thread. Funny how the monkey thing got turned to a slavery thing. I just wanted to say hey to all you nice people. I miss you guys. I'm still borrowing access. I will be back. I promise. (or is that a threat?) Take care. Seeya!

Post by **Minimalist** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 10:33 pm