Written communications 60,000 yrs ago ~ on ostrich shells

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circumspice
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Re: Written communications 60,000 yrs ago ~ on ostrich shells

Post by circumspice »

Rokcet Scientist wrote:
There are of course many reasons why, and MOs how to 'build' mounds. Be it symbolical, practical, or both.
But mounds are light years apart from cathedrals, temples, bath houses, catacombes, or aqueducts, in my book. The one is/are an expression of loose nomadic bands of HGs we call tribes (or, euphemistically: nations), the other an expression of organised city states. A level of development NA indians never achieved.



Not sure whether your use of "NA" stands for Native American or North American. However, the above quoted statement is grossly incorrect.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigenous ... e_Americas

While some indigenous peoples of the Americas were historically hunter-gatherers, many practiced aquaculture and agriculture. The impact of their agricultural endowment to the world is a testament to their time and work in reshaping, taming, and cultivating the flora indigenous to the Americas.[5] Some societies depended heavily on agriculture while others practiced a mix of farming, hunting, and gathering. In some regions the indigenous peoples created monumental architecture, large-scale organized cities, chiefdoms, states, and massive empires.

Many pre-Columbian civilizations established characteristics and hallmarks which included permanent or urban settlements, agriculture, civic and monumental architecture, and complex societal hierarchies.[18] Some of these civilizations had long faded by the time of the first permanent European arrivals (c. late 15th–early 16th centuries), and are known only through archaeological investigations. Others were contemporary with this period, and are also known from historical accounts of the time. A few, such as the Maya, had their own written records. However, most Europeans of the time viewed such texts as heretical, and much was destroyed in Christian pyres. Only a few hidden documents remain today, leaving modern historians with glimpses of ancient culture and knowledge.

According to both indigenous American and European accounts and documents, American civilizations at the time of European encounter possessed many impressive accomplishments.[19] For instance, the Aztecs built one of the most impressive cities in the world, Tenochtitlan, the ancient site of Mexico City, with an estimated population of 200,000. American civilizations also displayed impressive accomplishments in astronomy and mathematics.


Also:

http://en.allexperts.com/e/p/pr/pre-columbian.htm

Between 1800 and 300 BC, complex cultures began to form in Mesoamerica. Some matured into advanced pre-Columbian Mesoamerican civilizations such as the: Olmec, Teotihuacan, Maya, Zapotec, Mixtec, Huaxtec, Purepecha,Toltec and Mexica (Aztecs), which flourished for nearly 4,000 years before first contact with Europeans.

These indigenous civilizations are credited with many inventions in: building pyramid-temples, mathematics, astronomy, medicine, writing, highly accurate calendars, fine arts, intensive agriculture, engineering, an abacus calculation, a complex theology, and the wheel. Without any draft animals the wheel was used only as a toy. They used native copper and gold for metalworking.

Archaic inscriptions on rocks and rock walls all over northern Mexico (especially in the state of Nuevo León) demonstrate an early propensity for counting in Mexico. The counting system was one of the most complex in the world, with a base 20 number system. These very early and ancient count-markings were associated with astronomical events and underscore the influence that astronomical activities had upon Mexican natives before the arrival of Europeans. In fact, many of the later Mexican based civilizations carefully built their cities and ceremonial centers according to specific astronomical events.

The biggest Mesoamerican cities such as Teotihuacan, Tenochtitlan, and Cholula were among the largest in the world. These cities grew as centers of commerce, ideas, ceremonies, and theology, and they radiated influence outwards onto neighboring cultures in central Mexico.

While many city-states, kingdoms, and empires competed with one another for power and prestige, Mesoamerica can be said to have had five major civilizations: The Olmec, Teotihuacan, the Toltec, the Mexica and the Maya. These civilizations (with the exception of the politically fragmented Maya) extended their reach across Mexico — and beyond — like no others. They consolidated power and distributed influence in matters of trade, art, politics, technology, and theology. Other regional power players made economic and political alliances with these four civilizations over the span of 4,000 years. Many made war with them, but almost all peoples found themselves within these five spheres of influence.

Olmec civilization
The earliest known civilization is the Olmec. This civilization established the cultural blueprint by which all succeeding indigenous civilizations would follow in Mexico. Olmec civilization began with the production of pottery in abundance, around 2300 BC. Between 1800 and 1500 BC, the Olmec consolidated power into chiefdoms which established their capital at a site today known as San Lorenzo Tenochtitlán, near the coast in southeast Veracruz. The Olmec influence extended across Mexico, into Central America, and along the Gulf of Mexico. They transformed many peoples' thinking toward a new way of government, pyramid-temples, writing, astronomy, art, mathematics, economics, and religion. Their achievements paved the way for the later greatness of the Maya civilization in the east and the civilizations to the west in central Mexico.

Teotihuacan civilization
The decline of the Olmec resulted in a power vacuum in Mexico. Emerging from that vacuum was Teotihuacan, first settled in 300 BC Teotihuacan, by 150 AD, had risen to become the first true metropolis of what is now called North America. Teotihuacan established a new economic and political order never before seen in Mexico. Its influence stretched across Mexico into Central America, founding new dynasties in the Maya cities of Tikal, Copan, and Kaminaljuyú. Teotihuacan's influence over the Maya civilization cannot be understated: it transformed political power, artistic depictions, and the nature of economics. Within the city of Teotihuacan was a diverse and cosmopolitan population. Most of the regional ethnicities of Mexico were represented in the city, such as Zapotecs from the Oaxaca region. They lived in apartment communities where they worked their trades and contributed to the city's economic and cultural prowess. By 500 AD, Teotihuacan had become the largest city in the world. Teotihuacan's economic pull impacted areas in northern Mexico as well. It was a city whose monumental architecture reflected a monumental new era in Mexican civilization, declining in political power about 650 BC—but lasting in cultural influence for the better part of a millennium, to around 950 AD.
Maya architecture at Uxmal

Maya civilization
Contemporary with Teotihuacan's greatness was the greatness of the Maya civilization. The period between 250 and 650 AD was a time of intense flourishing of Maya civilized accomplishments. While the many Maya city-states never achieved political unity on the order of the central Mexican civilizations, they exerted a tremendous intellectual influence upon Mexico and Central America. The Maya built some of the most elaborate cities on the continent, and made innovations in mathematics, astronomy, and writing that became the pinnacle of Mexico's scientific achievements.

Toltec civilization
Just as Teotihuacan had emerged from a power vacuum, so did the Toltec civilization, which took the reigns of cultural and political power in Mexico from about 700 AD. Many of the Toltec peoples were comprised of northern desert peoples, often called Chichimeca in Mexico's Nahuatl language. They fused their proud desert heritage with the mighty civilized culture of Teotihuacan. This new heritage gave rise to a new empire in Mexico. The Toltec empire reached as far south as Central America, and as far north as the Anasazi corn culture in the Southwestern United States. The Toltec established a prosperous turquoise trade route with the northern civilization of Pueblo Bonito, in modern-day New Mexico. Toltec traders would trade prized bird feathers with Pueblo Bonito, while circulating all the finest wares that Mexico had to offer with their immediate neighbors. In the Maya area of Chichen Itza, the Toltec civilization spread and the Maya were once again powerfully influenced by central Mexicans. The Toltec political system was so influential, that any serious Maya dynasty would later claim to be of Toltec descent. In fact, it was this prized Toltec lineage that would set the stage for Mexico's last great indigenous civilization.

Aztec/Mexica civilization
With the decline of the Toltec civilization came political fragmentation in the Valley of Mexico. Into this new political game of contenders to the Toltec throne stepped outsiders: the Mexica. They were also a proud desert people, one of seven groups who formerly called themselves "Azteca," in memory of Aztlán, but they changed their name after years of migrating. Since they were not from the Valley of Mexico, they were initially seen as crude and unrefined in the ways of Nahua civilization. Through cunning political maneuvers and ferocious fighting skills, they managed to become the rulers of Mexico as the head of the 'Triple Alliance' (which included two other "Aztec" cities, Texcoco and Tlacopan).

Latecomers to Mexico's central plateau, the Mexica thought of themselves as heirs of the civilizations that had preceded them. For them, highly-civilized arts, sculpture, architecture, engraving, feather-mosiac work, and the invention of the calendar were because of the former inhabitants of Tula, the Toltecs.

The Mexica-Aztecs were the rulers of much of central Mexico by about 1400 (while Yaquis, Coras and Apaches commanded sizable regions of northern desert), having subjugated most of the other regional states by the 1470s. At their peak, 300,000 Mexica presided over a wealthy tribute-empire comprising about 10 million people (almost half of Mexico's 24 million people). The modern name "Mexico" comes from their name.

Their capital, Tenochtitlan, is the site of modern-day Mexico City. At its peak, it was one of the largest cities in the world with population estimates of 300,000. The market established there was the largest ever seen by the conquistadors when they arrived.
"Nothing discloses real character like the use of power. It is easy for the weak to be gentle. Most people can bear adversity. But if you wish to know what a man really is, give him power. This is the supreme test." ~ Robert G. Ingersoll

"Damn with faint praise, assent with civil leer, and, without sneering, teach the rest to sneer." ~ Alexander Pope
Rokcet Scientist

Re: Written communications 60,000 yrs ago ~ on ostrich shells

Post by Rokcet Scientist »

NA indians = north American indians.

I.o.w. every one north of Ciudad Juarez. To whom 99% of your exposé does not apply.
Minimalist
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Re: Written communications 60,000 yrs ago ~ on ostrich shells

Post by Minimalist »

Except, as Mann pointed out in 1491, the initial perception of Europeans in North America was that there were a great many Indians living in villages.

If you wandered into the outskirts of Little Rock, Arkansas and saw a trailer park would you conclude that all people in Little Rock lived in trailer parks?



Okay. Bad example. But you know what I mean!
Something is wrong here. War, disease, death, destruction, hunger, filth, poverty, torture, crime, corruption, and the Ice Capades. Something is definitely wrong. This is not good work. If this is the best God can do, I am not impressed.

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Re: Written communications 60,000 yrs ago ~ on ostrich shells

Post by Rokcet Scientist »

So where are the permanent structures? You know: something more than mounds? Something remotely akin to Ur, Luxor, Rome, Heliopolis, or Göbekli Tepe? What great scientific insights, theories, or principles have NA indians contributed to the general body of knowledge? Higher mathematics formulas then? Or what formative philosophies?
Come on, pre-Columbian NA indians didn't even have shoes. Or the wheel. Or iron. Or wovens.
Don't make them out to be more than they were. You're not doing veracity, history, or reality a favor.
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Re: Written communications 60,000 yrs ago ~ on ostrich shells

Post by Minimalist »

Again, you are letting your ethnocentrism shine through. People build out of what is handy. In a heavily forested region wood is the material of choice. In desert regions, people use mud brick.

The fact that they did not share your predisposition to building with stone or cement is almost meaningless.

Thanks to the Spanish and their book-burning priest/thugs we have little left of the thought of the even those civilizations who did build in stone.

Mann's whole point is that there was a disease-caused cataclysm which engulfed the New World.
Something is wrong here. War, disease, death, destruction, hunger, filth, poverty, torture, crime, corruption, and the Ice Capades. Something is definitely wrong. This is not good work. If this is the best God can do, I am not impressed.

-- George Carlin
Rokcet Scientist

Re: Written communications 60,000 yrs ago ~ on ostrich shells

Post by Rokcet Scientist »

Minimalist wrote:Again, you are letting your ethnocentrism shine through. People build out of what is handy. In a heavily forested region wood is the material of choice. In desert regions, people use mud brick.

The fact that they did not share your predisposition to building with stone or cement is almost meaningless.
Fine. So, wood, eh?
OK, did they build stuff like this then?

Image?

Dunno why it won't load. If you like go have a look at http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... Gadang.jpg.
Thanks to the Spanish and their book-burning priest/thugs we have little left of the thought of the even those civilizations who did build in stone.
No lo contendere. Carthage revisited.
Mann's whole point is that there was a disease-caused cataclysm which engulfed the New World.
[/quote]

I don't argue that. Quite the contrary. Disease wiped out 95% of the original inhabitants of the 'New World' in the 16th century, imo. (So we had to go you one better, and we went and made a whole subrace go extinct in the 17th century: the Hottentots... Talk about holocaust!).
As has probably happened before.
Like maybe with Clovis?
To me that still is a more easily acceptable scenario than the 'comet from the skies' hypotheses. I'm not saying those didn't drop from the heavens. Only that a flu or similar – like a contemporary version of H.I.V./AIDS... – can be just as effective. Or even more effective if there's a genetic 'hook' into Clovis' DNA making him extra susceptible. He would have been wiped out in 25 to 40 years. That is almost instantly as extinctions go in the paleolithical record.

It happens all the time: the Spanish flu killed 35 million people in Europe in 1919. The Black Plague of the 13th century is estimated to have killed 100 million Europeans. More than half the entire population.

Of course dying of the flu has a lot less sex appeal than gargantuan exploding comets...
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Sam Salmon
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Re: Written communications 60,000 yrs ago ~ on ostrich shells

Post by Sam Salmon »

Rokcet Scientist wrote: '''pre-Columbian NA indians didn't even have shoes. Or the wheel. Or iron. Or wovens.
Don't make them out to be more than they were. You're not doing veracity, history, or reality a favor.
Indigenous on the NW Coast of North America certainly did have shoes and woven garments.

It's late I'm beat if I have time/energy tomorrow I'll extrapolate a little.
Rokcet Scientist

Re: Written communications 60,000 yrs ago ~ on ostrich shells

Post by Rokcet Scientist »

Sam Salmon wrote:
Rokcet Scientist wrote: '''pre-Columbian NA indians didn't even have shoes. Or the wheel. Or iron. Or wovens.
Don't make them out to be more than they were. You're not doing veracity, history, or reality a favor.
Indigenous on the NW Coast of North America certainly did have shoes and woven garments.

It's late I'm beat if I have time/energy tomorrow I'll extrapolate a little.
Yeah, NW indians had shoes and woven garments allright. By the time Europeans saw them first it was two-and-a-half centuries (!) after Columbus! Imported technologies and culture had travelled to the NW (a lot) faster than the white man.
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Sam Salmon
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Re: Written communications 60,000 yrs ago ~ on ostrich shells

Post by Sam Salmon »

Rokcet Scientist wrote:
Sam Salmon wrote:
Rokcet Scientist wrote: '''pre-Columbian NA indians didn't even have shoes. Or the wheel. Or iron. Or wovens.
Don't make them out to be more than they were. You're not doing veracity, history, or reality a favor.
Indigenous on the NW Coast of North America certainly did have shoes and woven garments.

It's late I'm beat if I have time/energy tomorrow I'll extrapolate a little.
Yeah, NW indians had shoes and woven garments allright. By the time Europeans saw them first it was two-and-a-half centuries (!) after Columbus! Imported technologies and culture had travelled to the NW (a lot) faster than the white man.
I beg you pardon-your ignorance and arrogance are appalling. :roll:

The Salish people in present day British Columbia and WA state kept native dogs and used the fur to spin wool, they also hunted Mountain Goats for same and gathered some shed wool and used native plants.

Some remnants of this pre Colombian art survive today you can see them here if you're up for a visit

http://leqamellonghouse.ca/salish-weaving.html
Goat hair blankets were made for personal use, given as gifts to establish friendly relations, and distributed at the potlatch to display wealth. At potlatches leaders were known to give away between 300 and 400 blankets. At burials blankets were distributed as gifts. At a wedding a girl of high rank would have the path from her home to her husband's canoe covered with blankets. Women who devoted most of their time to weaving became specialists and their knowledge was passed on from mother to daughter. Weaving of blankets was an art form and a thriving industry.

Ingenuity and hard work were combined to create the materials used in weaving. Goat's wool was dusted with a white clay-like substance to absorb the oils and making it easier to spin. A combination of dog's hair, down from water fowl, and milk or fire weed was combined on a spindle. The yarn was used for finer garments. Colors used in weaving were black, yellow orange and brown. Black was produced by boiling hemlock, birch bark or fern roots. Yellow dye was created by immersing yellow lichen in water and bringing it to a boil. The wool was left I the dye bath until the desired color was obtained. Red was produced from the bark of the alder. Brown was obtained from hemlock bark and the husks of hazel-nuts.

The looms were of two types: the two bar vertical loom was used for large twilled blankets and the single bar was used for mats, dance aprons, rugs, sashes and tump-lines (pack straps).

To make baskets the inner bark of the Yellow Cedar was stripped off, boiled, and worked into a soft pliable condition. Strips of the desired width would be torn off and used. Bark strips were also pounded into shreds, combined into small separate fibres, and used in work that required finely spun material.

The plain, checkerboard or diagonal weave was common in the making of baskets, mats and pack straps. Twilled weave was common in the production of the large Salish blankets. Twined weave was used in making the finest pieces.

Twine produced from nettle fibre was used in making nets, fishing line and for a warp (vertical threads of the web) in weaving. Cat-tail (Tule) were cut, laid on racks to dry and used for mat making. Cherry bark was used for decoration in mats in and baskets. No pounding was necessary for cherry bark preparation. Baskets were used for cooking, collecting berries, storage, ornaments, and as a status symbol.


further reading here if you're interested in enlightening yourself
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Re: Written communications 60,000 yrs ago ~ on ostrich shells

Post by Rokcet Scientist »

Sam Salmon wrote: Indigenous on the NW Coast of North America certainly did have shoes and woven garments.

It's late I'm beat if I have time/energy tomorrow I'll extrapolate a little.
Rokcet Scientist wrote:Yeah, NW indians had shoes and woven garments allright. By the time Europeans saw them first it was two-and-a-half centuries (!) after Columbus! Imported technologies and culture had travelled to the NW (a lot) faster than the white man.
Sam Salmon wrote:I beg you pardon-your ignorance and arrogance are appalling. :roll:
Such amazingly elegant verbiage!
Sam Salmon wrote:The Salish people in present day British bla-di-bla
As observed and recorded by whom in pre-Columbian times...?
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Re: Written communications 60,000 yrs ago ~ on ostrich shells

Post by dannan14 »

Rokcet Scientist wrote:So where are the permanent structures? You know: something more than mounds? Something remotely akin to Ur, Luxor, Rome, Heliopolis, or Göbekli Tepe? What great scientific insights, theories, or principles have NA indians contributed to the general body of knowledge? Higher mathematics formulas then? Or what formative philosophies?
Come on, pre-Columbian NA indians didn't even have shoes. Or the wheel. Or iron. Or wovens.
Don't make them out to be more than they were. You're not doing veracity, history, or reality a favor.
Try reading "The Education of Little Tree" written by an 8 yr old when he was sent to live with his Cherokee grandparents. It's not at all scientific, but it will cover some of the "formative philosophies" you are asking about.
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circumspice
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Re: Written communications 60,000 yrs ago ~ on ostrich shells

Post by circumspice »

Rokcet Scientist wrote:NA indians = north American indians.

I.o.w. every one north of Ciudad Juarez. To whom 99% of your exposé does not apply.
The last time I checked, Mexico was attached to North America...

But, here is something from "north of the border".

Just because you wish that the indigenous peoples of the "so called New World" were uncouth, primative, barefoot, rawhide clad savages,
does not mean that they were. Your ethnocentrism is rabidly obvious.


http://www.questia.com/PM.qst;jsessioni ... =117040839


PUEBLO
, indigenous people of North America
name given by the Spanish to the sedentary Native Americans who lived in stone or adobe communal houses in what is now the SW United States. The term pueblo is also used for the villages occupied by the Pueblo. Their prehistoric settlements, known as the Anasazi and Mogollon cultures, extended southward from S Utah and S Colorado into Arizona, New Mexico, and adjacent territory in Mexico. The transition from Archaic (see Americas, antiquity and prehistory of the ) hunters and gatherers to sedentary agricultural populations occurred around the 1st cent. a.d., when corn, squash, and beans were widely adopted; the trio of foods is still used by the Pueblo. Although agriculture provided the bulk of the diet for these early populations, hunting and gathering was an important source of additional foodstuffs. Pottery manufacture began about a.d. 400 and was used for cooking and water storage. Clothing was woven from cotton, grown in warmer areas, and yucca fiber. Early houses among the Anasazi and Mogollon were pit houses, which were replaced by adobe and stone surface dwellings throughout the region by the end of the first millennium a.d.


Villages were variable in size and architectural content, but most included circular, often subterranean structures known as kivas (apparently a derivation of the pit house) and storage pits for grains. Prior to the 14th and 15th cent., densely settled villages were more the exception than the rule. Large pueblos were found at Chaco Canyon, dating to the 11th and early 12th cent., and at Mesa Verde, where multistoried cliff houses were inhabited in the 13th and 14th cent.; a great lunar observatory was built at Chimney Rock, S Colo., in the 11th cent. Changing climatic conditions forced the abandonment of much of the region by the early 14th cent., with populations migrating to their present-day locations in the Rio Grande valley and a few other isolated areas (e.g., the Hopi mesas).
"Nothing discloses real character like the use of power. It is easy for the weak to be gentle. Most people can bear adversity. But if you wish to know what a man really is, give him power. This is the supreme test." ~ Robert G. Ingersoll

"Damn with faint praise, assent with civil leer, and, without sneering, teach the rest to sneer." ~ Alexander Pope
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Re: Written communications 60,000 yrs ago ~ on ostrich shells

Post by Rokcet Scientist »

circumspice wrote:
Rokcet Scientist wrote:NA indians = north American indians.

I.o.w. every one north of Ciudad Juarez. To whom 99% of your exposé does not apply.
The last time I checked, Mexico was attached to North America...
Well, for your education then: Mexico is (the biggest) part of Middle America, a.k.a. Meso America. North America is obviously not Middle America...
And to be complete: there's also a South America. But you won't mix it up with North America, because South America is conveniently located to the south of Middle America. Although they were joined 4 million years ago, of course.
And to make matters worse: there's also a Latin America. That's all of America except North America! It comprises Middle America, South America, the Caribean, Little Havana, and Brooklyn.
But, here is something from "north of the border".

Just because you wish that the indigenous peoples of the "so called New World" were uncouth, primative, barefoot, rawhide clad savages, does not mean that they were. Your ethnocentrism is rabidly obvious.
As is your projecting prejudice: the qualifications 'uncouth', 'primative', 'rawhide clad', and 'savages' are your attributions, not mine, sir.
It's what the Germans so pointedly describe as 'hinein interpretieren'.
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circumspice
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Re: Written communications 60,000 yrs ago ~ on ostrich shells

Post by circumspice »

Rokcet Scientist wrote:So where are the permanent structures? You know: something more than mounds? Something remotely akin to Ur, Luxor, Rome, Heliopolis, or Göbekli Tepe? What great scientific insights, theories, or principles have NA indians contributed to the general body of knowledge? Higher mathematics formulas then? Or what formative philosophies?
[b]Come on, pre-Columbian NA indians didn't even have shoes. Or the wheel. Or iron. Or wovens.[/b]
Don't make them out to be more than they were. You're not doing veracity, history, or reality a favor.
What then, are pueblos?


And again:


PUEBLO
, indigenous people of North America
name given by the Spanish to the sedentary Native Americans who lived in stone or adobe communal houses in what is now the SW United States. The term pueblo is also used for the villages occupied by the Pueblo. Their prehistoric settlements, known as the Anasazi and Mogollon cultures, extended southward from S Utah and S Colorado into Arizona, New Mexico, and adjacent territory in Mexico. The transition from Archaic (see Americas, antiquity and prehistory of the ) hunters and gatherers to sedentary agricultural populations occurred around the 1st cent. a.d., when corn, squash, and beans were widely adopted; the trio of foods is still used by the Pueblo. Although agriculture provided the bulk of the diet for these early populations, hunting and gathering was an important source of additional foodstuffs. Pottery manufacture began about a.d. 400 and was used for cooking and water storage. Clothing was woven from cotton, grown in warmer areas, and yucca fiber. Early houses among the Anasazi and Mogollon were pit houses, which were replaced by adobe and stone surface dwellings throughout the region by the end of the first millennium a.d.
"Nothing discloses real character like the use of power. It is easy for the weak to be gentle. Most people can bear adversity. But if you wish to know what a man really is, give him power. This is the supreme test." ~ Robert G. Ingersoll

"Damn with faint praise, assent with civil leer, and, without sneering, teach the rest to sneer." ~ Alexander Pope
Rokcet Scientist

Re: Written communications 60,000 yrs ago ~ on ostrich shells

Post by Rokcet Scientist »

circumspice wrote:What then, are pueblos?
About the same level as pre-Harappan Indus Valley dwellings, or pre-Ur marshland peoples villages. Say, about 5,000 to 9,000 BC.
And again:

PUEBLO
, indigenous people of North America
name given by the Spanish to the sedentary Native Americans who lived in stone or adobe communal houses in what is now the SW United States. The term pueblo is also used for the villages occupied by the Pueblo. Their prehistoric settlements, known as the Anasazi and Mogollon cultures, extended southward from S Utah and S Colorado into Arizona, New Mexico, and adjacent territory in Mexico. The transition from Archaic (see Americas, antiquity and prehistory of the ) hunters and gatherers to sedentary agricultural populations occurred around the 1st cent. a.d., when corn, squash, and beans were widely adopted; the trio of foods is still used by the Pueblo. Although agriculture provided the bulk of the diet for these early populations, hunting and gathering was an important source of additional foodstuffs. Pottery manufacture began about a.d. 400 and was used for cooking and water storage. Clothing was woven from cotton, grown in warmer areas, and yucca fiber. Early houses among the Anasazi and Mogollon were pit houses, which were replaced by adobe and stone surface dwellings throughout the region by the end of the first millennium a.d.
So that's quite a gap. And still no wheel or writing "by the end of the first millennium a.d.". The pre-Harappan indo germans, or the southern Iraqi marshlanders also didn't have that, as far as we know. Their inventions changed everything: they begat cities, wars, trade, affluence, and history.

Without written records no history. That's the official definition of pre-historic...
Last edited by Rokcet Scientist on Tue Mar 23, 2010 7:42 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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