Neanderthal and Human Interbreeding Accepted?

[Minimalist]

Homo Habilus? Perhaps.

But I recall a documentary in which the evolution of HE was detailed and what HE looked like in the beginning was nothing compared to what he looked like at the end....which was essentially, us.

If I ever see it again I'll see if I can get it for you.

[Digit]

Thanks Min. That is the view of the Chinese, they maintain that the progression from HE to modern Chinese is seamless.
Another probIem I see with OOA 70000yrs ago as producing us all is skin colour. If HSS at that time was white we are faced with the problem of no other white Africans.
If he was black we are faced with the lack of black Eurasians, if he was yellow the problem vanishes, but then we are face with the difficulty of black Africans.
Once again the simplest solution would have to be that black Africans and the HSS who left Africa were parallel developments from a common ancestor, and that would have the Club performing loops!
So many problems vanish if we avoid the idea that every bone dug up in Africa was heading towards HSS, putting HE in and OOA along with HH solves the lot!

Roy.

[Minimalist]

OoA has become dogmatic. Like 19th century archaeologists who tried to turn every rock they found in the ANE into something that Moses had pissed on they are trying to cram every bone they find into OoA and it just doesn't work.

[Digit]

OoA has become dogmatic.

Yes I'm afraid it has, there was programme on Brit TV recently, fronted by a qualified person trotting out the same old line. The presenter was a woman in her 30s, so not of the old school, but still the same drivel!
It amazes me that these people fail to see the holes in their story, or they chose to ignore them of course.
Perhaps it's just us Min.
My personal take is that Homo arose in Africa, branched out into a number of forms and left Africa to continue his development and adaption elsewhere.
These people could have evolved from one ancestor, given sufficient time I guess, but what need would cause such differences?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... besman.jpg

http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9 ... hz6cE098Jl

Roy.

[Minimalist]

Repeated and prolonged in-breeding.

[Barracuda]

[quoteThanks Min. That is the view of the Chinese, they maintain that the progression from HE to modern Chinese is seamless][/quote]

Actually tend to belive that myself, but in Europe, not so much...

Given greater distances from Africa to East Asia, maybe only one species made it that far. Europe was much more diverse.

The two things can both be true..

[Digit]

If HSS arrived in Asia later that HE, which is logical, he would have found much of the place already occupied.
'Go West young Man!'

Roy.

[War Arrow]

The presenter was a woman in her 30s, so not of the old school, but still the same drivel!

This just conjures images for me of Julia Bradbury or one of those other interchangeable morons jumping around in a cagoule and asking "so Dave, what exactly is an owl?"

[Digit]

And they pay 'em! I watched a programme this evening and the American paleontologist stated, 'people think we understand everything about Dinosaurs from these programmes, but you'd be surprised how little we do know.'
Hallejah!

Roy.

[Cognito]

I also happen to be a multiregionalist and have been most of my life. The OOA story is just too simplistic and by now it should be obvious to anyone that it is a failed theory in its present form.

As pointed out elsewhere on this thread separate species are not supposed to produce viable offspring; however, that is what we have with HSS, HSN and the Denisovons. The Denisovans are probably either late H. heidelbergensis or Asian H. erectus. Either way, HSS was interbreeding with them while on the way and/or entering New Guinea and Australia. See: http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/ ... 091611.php. Personally, my money is on the Denisovans being Asian H. erectus. BTW, has anyone had the balls to check Native Americans for Denisovan influence?

Digit, as you pointed out, there are some problems in Africa, etc. That is made all the more plausible by this discovery:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-14947363

It appears that archaic species remained in Africa alongside HSS and continued to interbreed long after the GREAT EXODUS (Background chorus as Min parts the waters) of circa 50kya and long after conventional scientists think that these species went extinct.

Get ready, folks ... the fun is just beginning!!!

[Minimalist]

http://anthro.palomar.edu/homo/homo_2.htm


Could be my imagination but Dmanisi looks awfully centrally located.

[Digit]

I have no problem with Africa as the home of Homo, everything has to start somewhere, but most of us leave home eventually.
The difficulty of viable offspring from different species implies only one species, and that is exactly what I think we are, probably HE + sub species.
We parted, spread, then rejoined at various times later.
Propping up the classical OOA theory is beginning to look like an excercise in 'end of life' treatment.

Roy.

[circumspice]

(Background chorus as Min parts the waters)

Get ready, folks ... the fun is just beginning!!!

Min didn't need to part the waters!!! After all, they had BOATS, ya know!!!

[Digit]

Roy.

[Minimalist]

(Background chorus as Min parts the waters)

Get ready, folks ... the fun is just beginning!!!

Min didn't need to part the waters!!! After all, they had BOATS, ya know!!!

Damn tootin' they did!