Bosnian pyramids, Part II, no photos please!

[Guest]

we are at 10 pages already and most of it is just bickering about past events we have discussed over and over. i do not care about harding as evenif he just looked at the stone blocks, he still is qualified to speak about the stone blocks.

what i would like to see is the supporters of Os put aside their personal patriotism for awhile and concisely, analytically, honestly lay out what evidence they have to prove the theory, without the jumps to conclusions and assumptions.

show us the pictures that demonstrate that the dig is being done in the proper manner, and post what reports will back up your claims.

those of us who oppose will be honest and constructive in giving our dissent BUT this---'yes he is...no he isn't' or 'he said..she said' crap has got to stop because it is just childish and wasting time and space.

there is no reason to take this personally because no one is insulting bosnia we are just not satisfied with the manner in which this dig is being conducted. Os does not help himself in his cause and that is a fatal flaw but get over it, the man is a flake.

[stellarchaser]

we are at 10 pages already and most of it is just bickering about past events we have discussed over and over. i do not care about harding as evenif he just looked at the stone blocks, he still is qualified to speak about the stone blocks.

SO IS BARAKAT

what i would like to see is the supporters of Os put aside their personal patriotism for awhile and concisely, analytically, honestly lay out what evidence they have to prove the theory, without the jumps to conclusions and assumptions.

ADDRESS VISOKO MUSEUM AND THREE ARCHEOLOGISTS AND TWO GEOLOGISTS THAT WORK THERE

show us the pictures that demonstrate that the dig is being done in the proper manner, and post what reports will back up your claims.

ADDRESS VISOKO MUSEUM AND THREE ARCHEOLOGISTS AND TWO GEOLOGISTS THAT WORK THERE. IF THEY HAVE TIME, I'M SURE THEY WILL DO THEIR BEST TO FULFILL YOUR REQUEST.

those of us who oppose will be honest and constructive in giving our dissent BUT this---'yes he is...no he isn't' or 'he said..she said' crap has got to stop because it is just childish and wasting time and space.

YOU'RE RIGHT THERE

there is no reason to take this personally because no one is insulting bosnia we are just not satisfied with the manner in which this dig is being conducted. Os does not help himself in his cause and that is a fatal flaw but get over it, the man is a flake.

I'M SURE THAT THERE IS A REGULAR AND CIVILIZED WAY TO EXPRESS YOUR LEGITIMATE CONCERNS REGARDING EXCAVATIONS.

YOU WON'T GET ALL THIS ON THE FORUM, BECAUSE WE'RE HAVING SAME INFORMATION AS YOU, AND WE WOULD LIKE TO GET THESE THINGS TOO.

[Frank Harrist]

I've been on vacation for the past week and I just finished reading this entire thread. It sounds like a bunch of kids on the playground arguing over who's daddy is the toughest. As far as I can see there is definitely something there, archaeologically speaking, but as for it being a pyramid I'd say the jury is still out. Addressing the proffesionalism of the dig it appears that it's being done a little more haphazardly than we do it here in the states, but maybe that's the way they do it there...their perogative I guess. Sam Osmanagich is definitely a strange a flaky character, and I take anything he says with a grain of salt. It has been said and I agree that it's hard to form an educated opinion about anything based solely on pictures. So I'd have to say that even though I disagree with their methods, it's their country and their "pyramids" so let them do as they wish and report it to us as they are able. Personally I don't care where civilization started, it seems to have ended in this thread. Ya'll try to be nice to each other. Eratos, stellarchaser, cuiko,and RK seem to be the worst ones here about personal attacks which have no place in a civilized discussion. I realise (and have been guilty of it too) that sometimes tempers flare and things are said which a mature adult might regret later. Lets all just try to get along and together we can get to the bottom of this thing. (Frank the diplomat...that's a laugh, right?) Anyway I have also seen some very eloquent and very informative posts on this thread as well. Keeps those up. I don't actually have an opinion on this other than I don't think it's a pyramid in the literal sense of the word. there are man-made things there, but the consistency of the buliding materials just isn't there. Every hole they dig has different material in it. One question, did anyone think to dig on one of the corners? It would be interesting to see the structure there. Enough. Be kind to one another!

[Guest]

But meanwhile Stellarchaser, you're going to keep denigrating Harding and everyone else who disagrees with you, despite having no evidence to prove they are wrong and YOU are right.

[eratoh]

if you'll look carefully frank, i only respond to base comments like harding is a punk. thats where it begins. don't get me wrong, i love being #1. furthermore i also assume i'm talking directly to the foundation so i will tend to talk to packs of thieves a little differently.

[Frank Harrist]

if you'll look carefully frank, i only respond to base comments like harding is a punk. thats where it begins. don't get me wrong, i love being #1. furthermore i also assume i'm talking directly to the foundation so i do talk to packs of thieves a little differently.

Stellar and ciko both have bad tempers it seems, but so do you. So do I for that matter, but lately I try to reserve my flaming for something that actually matters. There will be years of excavation at this site so there's really no point in getting all worked up over it. It ain't affecting my paycheck or the price of tea in China so why raise my blood pressure? I'm patient enough to wait and see. Who cares if they destroy lots of real archaeology in their quest for.....whatever the hell they think they've found? It's theirs to do with as they wish.

[Yamemaru]

Define " brief and partial"? If you can't then, stop making stupid comments like this-

"However, Harding, who said he visited the site briefly on Thursday and looked at the same stone blocks Barakat said were man made, said on Friday they were a natural formation."

"Harding did not visit other sites in the area which Osmanagic and Barakat say are further evidence of the existence of pyramids in Bosnia, such as a tunnel leading to the top of Visocica or a stone pavement made of geometrically regular shaped pieces."

"Harding said that although he had not seen the stone pavement, by looking at photographs, "I would not believe it to be archaeological. It looks to me as a natural stone pavement." He did not visit the tunnel either."

There it is, black on white. About the whole adventure, please read here:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060610/ap_ ... ontroversy

So please could anyone tell us based on what Mr.harding gave his assesment of the Visocica site?

C'mon RK, I did my bit. His visit was abviously "brief" and "partial"; you are proffessional archeologist. You must know magic tricks of the trade: how to make proffesional assesment during brief and partial visit to archeological site.

you need spend only 1 second beside a pile of shite to determine it is in fact shite.

right, just like you.

[Yamemaru]

if you'll look carefully frank, i only respond to base comments like harding is a punk. thats where it begins. don't get me wrong, i love being #1. furthermore i also assume i'm talking directly to the foundation so i will tend to talk to packs of thieves a little differently.

did your parents take your toys away while u where little? so far u have been claiming u can turn shit into sugar and calling people shit heads for no reason at all.

[eratoh]

if you'll look carefully frank, i only respond to base comments like harding is a punk. thats where it begins. don't get me wrong, i love being #1. furthermore i also assume i'm talking directly to the foundation so i will tend to talk to packs of thieves a little differently.

did your parents take your toys away while u where little? so far u have been claiming u can turn shit into sugar and calling people shit heads for no reason at all.

the shit into sugar thing was me looking at the foundations consultant list and finding a place for me. there were folks that can change shit into almost anything but i didn't see sugar for alexs icecream.

alex seems to be suffering from a shite infliction. its filling his ears and eyes and flowing out of his mouth. thats got to be overflow. he needs to take it in or give it a good shake.

this in my opinion is a thread just for this type of thing. what else could it be? if theyre left alone in here they might convince some poor 8 year old to fedex his piggybank.

[Frank Harrist]

I bet there are a lotta fist fights in that part of the world. Either that or a lotta cowards who only talk shit on forums where they know they can't be touched. Ya'll grow up!

[eratoh]

I bet there are a lotta fist fights in that part of the world. Either that or a lotta cowards who only talk shit on forums where they know they can't be touched. Ya'll grow up!

my experience is either 6 on 1 or a punch to the back of the head when you're trying to walk away.

[ReneDescartes]

perhaps Os can indeed do what he likes in Bosnia and dig up the hill,Frank is right on that.Indeed it does not affect the price of tea .But does that mean that his claims need to remain unchallenged ?If there is no evidence of pyramids it needs to be demonstrated on this site above all, as it is dedicated to archaeology.
I grow more and more suspicious about some people posting here pretending not to be croonies of Os.Bu they seem to know all the small things going on in Visoko ,at least all the irrelevant things like how many hours or minutes somebody was where and did what on which particular day .
I hate to bring this up as I have no proof whatsoever of my statement except a gut feeling .Tell me Stellerchaser ,your name is Alex,right.THe other stellarchaser involved on the website of Oz is not you,but his name is Sasja.Isn't Sasja the diminuyive for Alex in every slavic language ?
I just would like to make sure you are not the same person,and please forgive me for using circumstancial evidence .

[eratoh]

this is a pretty important scam. don't kid yourself. its a taliban license.

[Paul H.]

nobody in the world can say to me that this is natural ,

http://www.bosnian-pyramid.com/gallery/ ... 0283m2.JPG

As a geologist with almost 20 years experience in being a geology for oil companies, consulting forms, federal agencies, and state agencies, I can say from the many hundreds of outcrops, including excavations for dam sites, I can say beyond any shadow of a doubt that this an excellent example of naturally jointed bedrock. More than enough pictures of this "dig" have posted to the Internet to make this determination. This specific "dig" at the Pyramid of the Moon is one the most classic examples of jointed bedrock a geologist could ever hope to see. It is both instructive and entertaining to see how confused people can be about its origin.

For example, look at the following pictures

1. http://www.piramidasunca.ba/news/11060602/DSCF7337.jpg

2. http://www.piramidasunca.ba/news/11060602/DSCF7285.jpg

3. http://www.piramidasunca.ba/news/11060602/DSCF7286.jpg

In these pictures, the three layers of blocks clearly extend into the finely laminated lake deposits, which comprise the local Miocene bedrock and the hill argued to be a man-made pyramid. This is not the type of layering, which will result from the building of pyramid or other structure. To argue that layers are man-made, a person would have to argue that modern man existed during the Miocene epoch millions of years ago.

Then there is the picture at:

http://www.slibe.com/images/668b8dc7-mo ... d5_jpg.jpg

These blocks, which are claimed to be man-made, exhibit well-defined ripple marks, which are absolutely natural in origin, on their surface. Even worse, the sets of ripple marks not only have the same orientation between each other but also appear to match across joints separating individual blocks. This clearly indicates that it is an in place layer of jointed bedrock. For the ripple marks to remain on the surface of the blocks, people would have had dug up a layer of bedrock and used it within any modification. Then, when laying the blocks, they would have had to carefully lay each these unmodified blocks such that the side showing the ripple marks was right side up as they were excavated from the ground. In addition, they would have had noted the exact position of the blocks as they dug it and laid the pavement or terrace as to carefully reassemble the blocks in exactly the same position as they were taken out of the ground such that the ripple marks on one block has the same orientation as the ripple marks on all of the other blocks and the pieces of an individual ripple mark broken by a joint lie adjacent to each other as they did in the original outcrop. People are not going to this when building pyramid or pavement.

For a detailed discussion about how the type of joints shown in the above pictures are created, go read:

Bai, T., Maerten, L., Gross, M. R., and Aydin, A., 2002, Orthogonal cross joints: Do they
imply a regional stress rotation? Journal of Structural Geology. vol. 24, pp. 77-88.

A 3 MB PDF version of this paper can be downloaded from:

http://pangea.stanford.edu/research/geo ... G_2002.pdf

Compare figures 1a, 1b, and 1c of the above paper with the pictures from the Pyramid of the Moon at:

http://www.bosnian-pyramid.com/gallery/ ... 0283m2.JPG

The people excavating the Bosnian pyramids might want to take the time to look at the layers of rectangular blocks, which are illustrated in the above paper, found along the Santa Barbara, California coast and illustrated in Figure 1a. . It is only a coincidence that these block layers also occur in Miocene age strata. More closer to home, they can look at the layer composed of rectagular blocks found at Nash Point along the shore of the Bristol Channel in the United Kingdom, which is illustrated in figure 1c.

If some people, including a few geologists geologists with PhDs, can continue to believe that the world is less 10,000 years old, I guess other people can believe that the above outcrop is man-made pavement. However, regardless of whether a person wants to either believe that Earth is less than 10,000 years old or the above picture from the "Pyramid of the Moon" shows man-made pavement does not make it true.

Yours,

Paul H.

[FreeThinker]

Here are some great pictures of natural formations that could be easily mistaken for the work of human hands:

http://www.mvermeulen.com/oneyear/Photo ... y7/735.jpg

http://images.statelibrary.tas.gov.au/t ... 514283.jpg

http://www.lufrahotel.com/images/pavement.jpg

http://www.ospreylodge.com.au/Views_files/image005.jpg

http://www.uwgb.edu/dutchs/geophoto/seismol/ECDELLS.jpg

http://www.walkabout.com.au/graphics/im ... 027035.JPG

The "walkways" purporting to be man made by Osmanagic's team look rather more like natural formations to me. Look carefully at these pictures of natural formations, then look carefully and with an open mind at the pics coming out of Osmanagic's website. How are these formations any different than the pics of natural formations found elswhere around the world? As has been pointed out the surface ripples line up as you would expect to find in a natural formation and unlike what you would find in something artificial. Also the layers of dirt between the layers of pavement is what you would expect from a natural origin. I still don't buy it. So far the case for a "pyramid" has been far from proven.